MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Has anyone here ever used the Motion Left Mopeds reed adapter intake before? Looks like a pretty cool way to improve the low end on piston ports kits, but is it worth $100~? Is the difference really that noticeable?

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Im curious as well, but I have only seen one in person, and I wouldnt trust the guys tuning abilities either way...

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

I might pick it up with the current sale since I have some extra money that just came in and give it a try. If I end up buying it I'll post my thoughts later if anyone's interested.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

I've reed valved a couple piston port cylinders. Some are better to modify than others, though the best luck I've had is with AV10 reeds, and burying them in the intake port.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Interesting design. I bet if you really port for reeds,

It would be crazy awesome.

Not as good as a V Reed, but still good.

Problem is for the dummies who bolt it on and expect some performance out of it without modding the kit. That's just stupid.

Better to save your money to buy a better helmet to save the few brain cells you have.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

I bought one of those to put on a garelli but I ported the intake too much and it wouldn't seal so now I'm trying to make a reed block adaptor plate. I'm interested to see how everyone ports their cylinder to take advantage of the reeds

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

DrGeorgeTompson (Alan) /

So wait, now i'm confused.

What are you guys porting? The intake like on the side of the jug?

or is it the transfers that need porting?

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

I ported the intake where the manifold seals but made it too large for the reed adapter.

From my understanding just throwing the Reed adapter on won't do too much for performance. Maybe give a little bit more low end. I started making a channel from the intake up to act as a third transfer. I also started cutting a window in the piston so I have more intake timing.

There's a thread here about minarelli Reed valve adapters that has some cool pictures of porting to take advantage of the reeds. I think Jbot did some crazy stuff. I'm just a little scared to go too far.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

DrGeorgeTompson (Alan) /

I am big fan of reeds but probably more of a fan of my carbs not spraying premix backwards.

I was considering doing this on my Garelli but my kit is still pretty new and I probably shouldnt accidentally turn it into a paperweight yet.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

It's very easy to port for these reeds.

After you do this, it will not run with piston port anymore.

You window the piston and window the cyl skirt on the intake side so the mix coming in from the carb jumps into the cases with no piston to shut it off.

You can cut a big port from the bottom of the intake all the way down to the cases. Then cut a boost port above the intake, being careful not to go to too close to a ring gap. It's not the end of the world tho if you do.

Top of the boost port should be angled pointing towards the plug,

And the top should be around the same height as the transfers.

You do this, and it's gonna blast.

Don't raise ex until you see how it runs.

You can widen it to 65% of bore with no ill effects *

(* only if the ring gaps are on the intake side.

Watch out for mobys and hero kits with the gaps on the ex side, barf)

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

piston port acts like a valve limiting the intake timing, when you add a reed valve you no longer need to limit your intake timing and you can add a big window to your piston or hog that sucker out to take advantage of the full flowin' reed action.

i think by the time you went through the effort to port and bolt on the adapter, you could just as easily cut out a riser and slide some reeds down in there for better flowing and case volume action, but then again maybe not.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

derp we posted at the same time.

Mike Naz did a super clean reed valve on a 70cc kstar, used to have pics of it online,

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Variated bikes are really the best candidates for this.

But even single speeds will benefit if you port right

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

The goal is to get the new transfer to open a little before the existing transfers right? or should I aim for a little after the existing transfers?

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

DrGeorgeTompson (Alan) /

JBOT, Bro Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> You window the piston and window the cyl skirt on

> the intake side so the mix coming in from the carb

> jumps into the cases with no piston to shut it

> off.

Boy I feel stupid for forgeting there's a piston in the way sometimes. That's not too crazy to do though.

I still want to do this. Maybe next summer.

I dont think a riser is really a viable option on an NOI motor. There's not much intake clearance to begin with.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

JBOT, Bro Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> It's very easy to port for these reeds.

> After you do this, it will not run with piston

> port anymore.

> You window the piston and window the cyl skirt on

> the intake side so the mix coming in from the carb

> jumps into the cases with no piston to shut it

> off.

>

> You can cut a big port from the bottom of the

> intake all the way down to the cases. Then cut a

> boost port above the intake, being careful not to

> go to too close to a ring gap. It's not the end of

> the world tho if you do.

>

> Top of the boost port should be angled pointing

> towards the plug,

> And the top should be around the same height as

> the transfers.

>

> You do this, and it's gonna blast.

> Don't raise ex until you see how it runs.

> You can widen it to 65% of bore with no ill

> effects *

>

> (* only if the ring gaps are on the intake side.

> Watch out for mobys and hero kits with the gaps on

> the ex side, barf)

When you say "very easy", could someone with little to no experience do it? I've been reading a lot about port timing / matching / reshaping over the last few days, but I'm a little bit nervous as I don't have any real hands on experience. The reed adapter is coming in today and I was thinking of starting porting either this weekend or next. Worst case I do have a backup cylinder (no piston for it though, will have to buy that) from the previous owner that I could practice on to not mess up my current running build.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Neil Verchot Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> The goal is to get the new transfer to open a

> little before the existing transfers right? or

> should I aim for a little after the existing

> transfers?

For the boost? Don't worry about it.

Put it about the same height as the mains unless you are decent at porting.

The main point to the reeds is for giant unrestricted intake mix which was formerly limited by the piston shutting it off.

Once the engine has as much mix as it can handle, you can port the exhaust to take advantage of all that new mix to create more power thru excellent scavenging (getting the ex the fuck out of the cyl)

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

"When you say "very easy", could someone with little to no experience do it? I've been reading a lot about port timing / matching / reshaping over the last few days, but I'm a little bit nervous as I don't have any real hands on experience. The reed adapter is coming in today and I was thinking of starting porting either this weekend or next. Worst case I do have a backup cylinder (no piston for it though, will have to buy that) from the previous owner that I could practice on to not mess up my current running build."

If you have a dremel it's very easy. Just cannot be afraid.

The bits that I use are super cheap on eBay (long shaft carbide cutter kit

Only like $10 or so. Long shaft and big curved heads which work great) I use 2t oil to lubricate the cutter head

The dummy rules for Reed porting are these:

1.Don't chip the plating, if you do just sand smooth

2. After you're done, clean the shit out very well, I wash cyl and piston in the sink. Gotta dry and oil super quick if it's cast iron.

I push paper towels with dish soap thru the transfers to get all the debris out, then do it again after its clean and dry with paper towel covered in 2t oil before reassembly

3. Chamfer every sharp with a light 45deg dremel hit, then 220 paper

4. If the dremel slips it's probably no big deal. Just sand the area to be smooth

5. Look at pics on MA and port with the idea of what happens with the flow.

It goes in thru the intake, thru the reeds, down into the cases (now with the additional hole in piston and cyl skirt), then is pushed from under the piston up into the transfers to the top of he cyl on the pistons downstroke. Make it flow into the cases easily, make it flow easily from under the piston into the transfers. That's how I view it.

6. Don't go too high with the ex ceiling with single speeds. If it's a decent timed kit, I don't go up at all. Just widen.

7. Oil everything a bit when reassembling

8. FOR FUCKS SAKE MEASURE THE FUCKING SQUISH. It's easy,

Look up how to do it. If it's over 1mm, change your head gasket or base gasket to get it close to 1mm. It makes a huge difference if how a bike runs. (edited)

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Do you see where I cut out the intake skirt and the mix from the intake can now go right into the cases? It can also go thru the piston's new hole.

Whether you cut a window or remove the center of the intake cylinder skirt,

Make sure it's structurally sound. Don't leave a tiny strip that could break off.

The last pic is a v1 cyl, they are very long so most of that cutout below the intake is going to be your mopeds cyl skirt. Cut a hole in said skirt instead on all non V1 cyls. As well, those boost ports I cut are just examples. Do not copy. Do ports that work with your ring gaps (avoid the gaps by a few mm on the boost ports you make)

I have a hero kit I Reed ported, will take a pic of that today.

image.jpeg
image.jpeg
image.jpeg

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Btw, the last pic above has all the boosts AT THE SAME HEIGHT!

It is an optical illusion that they are at varying heights.

I did same height as the transfers (pretty close)

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

image.jpeg

My Reed adaptor back s few years ago with hero kit.

Porting pics aren't too good so I'll do some more today.

My skirts had to be removed because of an incident. Still ran fine.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Thanks, I feel a lot more reassured now. I'm going to be doing this port on a 62cc malossi cylinder I have lying around. I do also have a piston for it somewhere but it soft seized and scored very slightly in a few spots, and it looks severely burned from blowback. The seized spots can't be seen in this picture, but they're there. The cylinder is still A-OK though. Seeing as a new piston costs around 80$, I'm going to just buy a new ring and lightly sand down the piston where the seized scoring is (it's very very light.)

Please do post the picture of your hero reed port if you have time, anything that would help me study up a bit before I set about doing this will help!

I do have a dremel but no carbide cutting tips. Will order some or pick some up at the local hardware store.

Are the boost ports necessary? I feel like those are the easiest part to fuck up and ruin the whole job. Could I get away with just cutting an intake transfer down into the crank case, making a piston window, cutting a window in the cylinder skirt, and then doing some slight case matching / roughing up of the intake / smoothing out of the exhaust? Would there be noticeable performance gains?

I will make a port map of this cylinder when I get home from work and then sketch out an example port map of what I want to accomplish to add the reeds. I'll post both here for some criticism and thoughts before I actually begin cutting it up.

piston.jpg

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

DrGeorgeTompson (Alan) /

cactus porting 4 lyfe. Olé!

cactus.jpgc040583b-011b-41e4-b531-4db5ce5dfd74Larger.jpg

But really, I understand how porting work can be daunting.

Just take it slow.

Never forget you can always take more off but that shit's not going back on.

Don't be like me and have the shakiest hands while you hamfist your ports with the dremel. I think a right angle attachment would help substantially. I have an extendo dremel noodle and that helps but only because it makes the business end a little thinner. Many sopts are still super hard to reach without touching the cylinder walls.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Yes, boosts are not required.

But they help.

Even piston port kits have boosts.

Look a hero kit or eurokit.

Only diff between pp boosts and reed boosts is connection to the intake.

PP boosts cannot have the boosts attached to the intake port or the bike won't run.

There's always a bit of cyl wall between the intake and boosts.

Cyl reed boosts connect to the intake because they can and its mo bettah

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Love these. The curved bellies help make great contours.

They grab a bit on shitty played cyls,

But using lube and high speeds helps.

Dulling them up helps too strangely enough.

There's all sorts of the same kits on eBay. I don't know this seller. Just a link to the cutters I use.

http://m.ebay.com/itm/130623386487 (edited)

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Ah, that makes sense. I might consider adding them but not going too crazy just in case. I'll draw this all on the map and post it here so you guys can make fun of my porting abilities and I can learn something out of it and not fuck up the cylinder.

Am I correct in assuming that the ring on a piston is pretty much the only thing that matters? As in a piston can be all burned up like mine and scored in a few places but as long as you sand it finely and change out the ring it should be good to go? From what I understand as long as the cylinder and rings aren't messed up it should be fine to run. The head of the piston is a little bit pockmarked too but it's not life threatening, just here and there.

edit:

Oh yeah, should I grab some super fine sand paper and lightly go over the cylinder as well if a soft seize happened but there's no serious scoring or marking? It still looks super clean with cross hatching. (edited)

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

If the bore is warped and worn badly,

A new ring might make compression for a bit.

Eventually you'll stop making enough comp to run.

Is it a plated cyl? Pic?

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

Then yes, most worn Pistons will still be fine to run with a new ring as long as they're not too fucked at the ringland.

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

I'll take a picture when I get home from work. Like I said, the bore seems to be fine. It only soft seized once and most of the scoring seems to be on the piston and not the cylinder walls. When I took it apart after the soft seize, the piston and rings still seemed to sit very snugly inside, the piston would move up and down in the cylinder but wouldn't wiggle around.

Edit:

Could I just use this piston? It seems to have the same dimensions as the malossi.

For comparison, here's a malossi replacement:

http://www.treatland.tv/puch-malossi-62cc-42mm-replacement-piston-p/puch-malossi-piston-342162.htm

Here's the one I'm thinking of getting:

http://www.treatland.tv/honda-wallaroo-METEOR-overbore-piston-42mm-1-5-p/peugeot-meteor-piston-42mm.htm

Would be about the same price as just buying a new ring and I'd feel good about having a new piston.

Or I could overbore it to 43mm at a NAPA store and buy a 43mm overbore piston? (edited)

Re: MLM Reed Adapter Thoughts?

I cannot give you any piston advice.

Idk.

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