PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Got one of the $60 PHBG clones from US seller dynoscooter_performance in this week. It looks more like the one treats sells than the one pictured (which looks more like an authentic Dellorto), it has gloss paint and two rings around the spigot, not one. Casting and machining quality is not perfect, some burrs to clean up here and there and a few loose shavings ready to get sucked in to the engine if you don't clean it out before installing, but all the passages are drilled through completely and the small components actually look decent quality.

PHBG21_Clone.jpg

It came with an AU atomizer bushing, 90 Main, and 60 Starter. The rest of the components are unmarked, but the atomizer ID measures the same as a 262 AU.

PHBG21_Clone2.jpg

The needle has a longer taper length and a smaller tip size, maybe a W16, I didn't take exact measurements.

Dell left, clone right:

PHBG21_Clone_Needle.jpg

(edited)

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Maciek Dub /

The slide has a bit more cutaway, think it's probably a 50, or maybe a 60, not sure, never had those in hand.

Dell left, clone right:

PHBG21_Clone_slide.jpg

The clone idle air jet, or whatever you want to call the thing in the idle air intake passage, is slotted, and you can unscrew it for cleaning, or change it/drill it if you felt the need I guess. The PHBG had no such screw driver slot:

PHBG21_Clone_idle_air_jet.jpg

It also did not come with the UFO-dish that sits around the main jet. (edited)

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Maciek Dub /

Now, for the meat of the matter, and the main reason I started this post, I noticed two distinct differences that affect how easily the bowl can fill with fuel;

First of all, the Dellorto has a couple of passages drilled trough the casting on both sides of the needle valve to give the fuel some other way to flow in to the bowl other than around the needle:

PHBG_needle_valve_fuel_hole.jpg

The clone does not have this hole, leaving the fuel to flow around the needle, as is typical in most carbs, It should still flow plenty of fuel, but may be something to look at if you're having issues with running the bowl dry:

PHBG_clone_needle_valve.jpg

The needle valve bore is also brass-lined. (edited)

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Maciek Dub /

Secondly, and this is more likely to be an issue, especially combined with the above; the needle valve bore stack is bigger OD, and the float limiting tab is bent a little differently, the combination of these two factors means it hits the stop much earlier, limiting the float's downward movement so it can just barely open the needle valve by less than a mm at full open, compared to a few mm on the authentic unit.

Here is the PHBG float valve when fully open:

PHBG_float_limiting_tab.jpg

And the clone, notice the float valve is not open nearly as far:

PHBG_clone_float_limiting_tab.jpg

I had to bend it out a ways for it to let the float drop and open the needle valve all the way.

Hope some of You find this useful, especially if you haven't had either one in hand and trying to make a buying decision. Once I get the authentic unit tuned in on the puch I'll swap this in and compare, I want to eventually use the authentic Italian unit on the Garelli.

peace,

~M (edited)

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

I'll share my cloning experience. I purchased a couple race clones from treats once to run/compare to my Dellortos... My findings were pretty similar to yours. However, On one unit the paint flaked off inside of the bowl base clogging jets, and the float swelled up and crumbled. I suspect ethanol in gas as the primary culprit combined with a weak coating and plastic. I had to go through the task of cleaning, scraping, and then removing the rest of the interior "powder coat". Treats also hooked me up with a replacement float I've had no performance troubles since. So lets just say it wasn't bolt'n'go, but what is in mopeds really?

Note, I will confirm my treats clones both came with W16 needle and a AU262 atomizer. The next time I bought a Dellorto i stuck with an OG Dellorto.

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Maciek Dub /

Thanks for contributing! Funny, I had a flake off the inside the authentic Dellorto bowl get up on the side of the needle and jam the valve open, so I guess it's not just a clone problem. I did get my delly used just cause they're so expensive new, did have signs of wear but in decent shape overall, I didn't have to replace anything. I might get a new top gasket for it though cause cause the slide hits the cap with a half a mm or so still hanging in the bore, figure the old one got compressed, or I can double them up. This is not a problem on the clone. I will watch the float on the clone closely.

Here is a PHBG needle chart for measuring reference:

peace,

~M (edited)

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

#CrazyWayne™ rocks. #CrazyWayne /

W5 and W3 ??

Fuck clones thy just suck

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Jonathan Eaton /

Just got my 17.5 phbg ad clone in today, I think these clones are kinda like cover bands, if you can get over the fact that they arent the real deal they arent that bad. Heres pics of mine, all jets and atomizers and the needle inside were unmarked. I replaced the main jet with a real dellorto 88, and put a dellorto 42 idle in it. I'm running it on my polini kitted ssxl and although ive only been testing it for a few hours it is a massive improvement over the stock SHA. It is running very rich at the moment, but the 88 main was a very conservative start. I'll have more reports as I continue to tune.

image32.JPG
image34.JPG
image42.JPG

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

At some point you get old and lazy and decide the extra.3 hours spent getting the fucker to work isnt worth saving 40 bucks or whatever.

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

And then you get older, go insane and start messing with the 22 dollar and under shipped ebay Chinese units. Best goddamn carburetors available

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Maciek Dub /

If You figure out how it's supposed to work you can get anything to work. Problem with the super cheap china clamp-ons is the clamps break real easy, a buddy of mine went through three of them before he finally got a spigot in stead. We've got lots of phbg spares now lol. That's why I stuck to a pricier us seller one.

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

haha true that snords.

you also don't have an old lady and kiddo burning up all your precious time.

I said fuck a phbg about 5 years ago and haven't looked back, VM mikuni on everything in build... thinking about making the jump to OKO just because i need better spigot options.

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

I acknowledge. My most productive years have been those when I don't have a girl friend. And Nijon carbs or Nijon designed carbs are the way to go and especially if you don't like stopping all the time for gas. I am into the PZ 19 to PZ 22s especially. They are made for 4 strokes but you can screw a dellorto jet in them tightly and micro drill out the idle jet and you are good to go. I also ditch the butterfly choke and fill the resultant choke shaft hole with JB.

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Flagrant - Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> And then you get older, go insane and start

> messing with the 22 dollar and under shipped ebay

> Chinese units. Best goddamn carburetors available

Hahaha

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

True that Graham. I just switched to Oko about a month ago and I loveeee them...do it! There are a couple tweaks required (check/set float bowl height, carefully file down bowl drain hole for idle jet access, replace some of the crappy Phillips bolts), so your inner old man might groan a little. Totally worth it though. I'm a genuine carb guy, but PWK doesn't have a legit carb smaller than 28mm so I opted for the known good copy. And...power jet...sick

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Sorry Steve I wasn't sure if you were being serious or not...if so, please discuss. I just picture this crazy old man trying to make a dozen POS carbs work right with a buncha "dang nabbits!"

Although, nice write up once again, Maciek.

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

No dag nabits needed. I have only used this carb on reed engines however so not sure if its piston port friendly.

Re: PHBG Racing Clone vs Dellorto comparison and review

Jonathan Eaton /

^Flagrant, I put my clone PHBG on my piston port garelli polini kit. It's far better than an SHA at feeding piston port engines, however I can't really compare it to any other carb as I've only used it and SHAs. Also I think a part of the improvement I'm seeing on my garelli is the PHBG intake is a much bigger and free flowing intake so it takes advantage of the larger than stock polini intake port.

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