Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

♣Slew Foot♣ /

okay i am bored and the tinfoil helmut is picking up the ht lines down the way...

if you were to redesign the flow path of the entire pedmotor's intake exhaust path so that it induces a vortex into the intake and say the ports were angled and joined as to induce a vortex in the combustion chamber run it out into an expansion chamber with a deflection disk with increasing sized airholes to again get a vortex in the exhaust pattern.

would it even matter cause it's just f'in mopeds...

settle down...

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

I think it may be an illusion that a vortex improves mass flow. Does anyone know better?

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

i was just reading an article on 4T bench flow testing .

scroll to swirl and tumble,

in essence: "Within the industry, a debate has been raging on mixture motion with some looking to increase it, while others want to eliminate it."

what i walked away with was:

"the energy that's used to swirl the mixture would be best used to increase the airflow capacity"

you do not want the intake charge mixing with the exhaust inside the cylinder, don't cross the streams.

tumble perfectly describes loop scavenging.

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

The ford tempo/mercury topaz had a "high swirl" design... And just look how fast those were.

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

The swirling has been used in attempts to improve atomization. The path of a swirl or vortex is more lengthy that straight through and so it takes more time to get to point B

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

I can only, first hand. recall Honda and their VTEC-E (civic VX) engine design in an attempt to induce an ultra lean burn (22:1) that shut one of the two intake valves off below 2500RPM. This brought the charge in from one corner of the chamber and created a swirling effect that aimed to atomize the mixture further.

They likely did this directly in the combustion chamber to reduce the problem of the long travel distance of a swirling mixture vs a straight flow. You could argue that it was for simplicity but the mechanism that controlled the operation of the valves although simply actuated was not simple in itself.

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

♣Slew Foot♣ /

yopaz's holy s'in crap, i did not realize the implications, i figure it would concentrate the ignition fireball so to expand into the peripherial areas with a faster more effective flash.

the exhaust path is weird cause for low end you really do want a longer pipe so an extended exhaust path may be goodly.

they had those carb inserts to create a swirlie too for gas economy.

on a car noone would notice the power differences but a one cylinder you would.

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

♣Slew Foot♣ Wrote:

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> they had those carb inserts to create a swirlie

> too for gas economy.

And they are completely full of crap on those too.

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

Ryan, the precursor to that was CVCC, or is that what you meant, not the variable cam timing?

those aftermarket "vornado" inserts created havok with maf systems, snake oil indeed.

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

No no not variable cam timing at all. A selected disengagement of one intake valve entirely. The engine was designated VTEC-E but actually had no high lift/duration lobe like the others. The VTEC simply engaged all 16 valves rather than 12.

Re: Tinkering with flow patterns pro-con?

♣Slew Foot♣ /

as long as we are discussing long discontinued fuel economy gadgets.

how about running copper fuel line around the head to preheat/vaporize it before the carb.

remember the gadget that ran off the radiator then to the carb that didn't work unless you actually used the manifold gases instead of radiator fluid to preheat it.

plymouth fury III that gets 32 mpg. snake oil, i keep looking for that, blaster oil is 37% snake oil after all. prolly makes goodly 2t oil.

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