critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

first off: sorry for the novel. i like long posts.

e50

kstar 70 old version

head is new, for the 70 kit, but not hihicomp.

ports chamfered, piston and cylinder cleaned up

3 shoe

needle bearing crank (86 e50)

case matched

bing 15, 15 intake (square port)

modified treats hi-flo foamy intake

timing full advance w/o moding the stator plate

proma circuit pipe

tecno estoril baffle, a lil leaky

16 x 40 gearing

sea level (downtown cleveland)

84 jet, when i started tuning i had no baffle

no baffle, needle all the way rich = lots of 4 stroking

no baffle, needle 1 notch from the top = snappy!

baffle, needle all the way lean = wow.

clutch engages at 20 mph, hits the pipe at 30, hits a wall at 42-44 mph.

i'm affraid that with the 16x40 gearing i'm gonna blow it up if i keep going to 40ish, while i break it in. i bought the kit used, previous owner chamfered ports and ran it for ? roffman cleaned up the piston and cyl, casematched it, advanced and set the timing, put on the 3 shoe, basicly built the engine.

so where i live (downtown cleveland) lots of stop n go, lots of hills, hence the 16x40 gearing. i think i'm gonna get a 17, i have an 18 but i think its too tall. my main concern, of course, is that I DONT WANT TO BLOW UP THE KIT.

so, MA Perf forum dudes, please advise.

special thanks to roffman for correcting all of my noob mistakes and being a really cool dude in general. special thanks to Rob P for convincing me to kit the magnum. special thanks to the MA performance forum, my favorite forum ever.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

for that gearing and pipe I would think 45 sounds about right.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

40mph at 16x40 is right around 8000rpm... i think it should take alot more than that to blow her up....

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

i thought that 40mph @ 16x40 would be between 9-10k rpm

is there a spreadsheet for gearing?

also, kstars are a bit "rattly" during break-in right?

i can hear a pingy kind of rattle at idle, can't hear it at speed (full face w/ visor down)

thanks for the response!

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

in the puch section of the wiki there is a rpm spreadsheet... i had a 70 tccd kit for a while which i think is pretty similar and it sounded pretty wild too...

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

The pingy is likely due to the rough ports, a little chamfering may help, it did with mine.

as for gearing, i've heard stock gearing for break in is ideal

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

ports were lightly chamfered

16 x 40

rpms mph

4000 20.7

5000 25.9

6000 31.1

6500 33.7

7000 36.3

7500 38.9

8000 41.5

8500 44.0

9000 46.6

9500 49.2

10000 51.8

11000 57.0

how was this measured?

i'm asking, how accurate is this?

its from the spreadsheet avaliable if you follow the links in the wiki.

during break in, should i limit my rpms? what should i limit them too?

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

) Cupermcnewbster ( /

hit all rpms, just limit the highest to only 30% of the time or less. Depends how you like to ride. If its all tight, it doesn't really matter.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

you mean, no air leaks? yeah no air leaks here bro. idles high during warm up, then settles down after 5 min.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

16X40 is the same as 18X45 if anyone is interested. I had no idea my K-Star was turning such high RPM. Thanks

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

steve what kind of rpms are you hitting with your kstar? whats your setup? i've been advised to limit to 8k or less for the first 300 miles to break it in properly.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Gap your ring if you haven't already

critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

#CrazyWayne™ rocks. #CrazyWayne /

Pull the head wrap 80 gret sand paper around a gulf ball.

Place ball in center of head push and turn ball till you cut a 3mm wide ring in head cup.

palish cut and install head.

Set timing at 19deg BTDC.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Good one on the golf ball squish trick, thanks wayne. Chris, I am running faster than 50, never gpsed. Iwill try to rattle off my set up. 19 degree advance as mr powerchair suggsts, 15.5:1 compression, widened exhaust port, homemade 19mm intake, widened intake port, 19mm Dellorto carb, volswagen 6V coil, header and exterior exhaust port matched to a Homoet 6P, the usual smoothing of transfers etc. If I put a 36 tooth sprocket on the back it has enough overall HP to go faster. There are quite a few things I could do to get more RPM out of it. Big pipe, big carb, big exhast port, 230psi compression test will get you there. If you put a 24mm Mikuni flatside on it with matched intake and porting it would handle it. Most people who have 6Ps have more sophisticated cylinders but the K-Star loves it and the pipe comes on reasonably early. It's an unloved cylinder but with a little gentle coaxing it delivers ample power with better than average durability. And as Dan says gap that ring. .015 inch for me

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

No comment on your engine setup itself but if it's Cleavland, Ohio that you are speaking of I'm pretty sure that it is well above sea level so I wouldn't use sea level figures for setting your carb. I think that you could find the figure either online or in an atlas.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

650 feet above sea level. is that a lot? I have no idea. I will try the golf ball trick. I think the ring was gapped properly, I will check with roffman. will that help with the 'pinging'? 50 = 10k plus rpms, that's impressive. yea i've heard with just light widening and mild porting, plus matched intake, bigger carb/pipe you can really wind those kstars out.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Bigger carb and intake, matched to your cylinder should give you a couple extra mph's.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Probably Fred /

The transfers I made huge you could go with bigger carb the ring gap was more than 015. this kit was used I cleaned it up that is it. all the star or treat kits I had or put on(6or 7) pinged none broke I always gear them to go 8500rpm or less at top speed

1256748887_p8200099.jpg

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

im not big on those goofy foamy air cleaners, i prefer a magnum/freesprit/pinto murray tube one , seem to run better.

Sounds like your in the right range dude.

THose kits are fucking LOUD, especially if your not used to em or used to an iron bore metra.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

i have the og magnum filter, i will experiment with it.

untill the tank is cleaned this got put on teh backburner.

but tomorrow i think i will take care of the tank and continue the break-in process. i want to wind it out, but i'm 260 miles away from that... i rode my stock sachs tonight and i was like, wow this thing is quiet as a church mouse!!

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Probably Fred /

The stock tube( great for 50cc and stock ) ones block the air flow more than the foam ones and those don't flow as good as I need so I cut slots in the rubber mounting part and cover with foam for more flow

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

i just take the screen out and put tiny bit of big foam in there and dont ride in dust storms lol

that metal air filter in the magnum tube can be restrictive, take it out and put panty hose or something less restictive. Dont be like me and use nothing lol

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Throw a 19mm carb and a boss pipe and do 50+

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Because tha cylinder gulps the air so suddenly and then blows mixture back out the carb I can't use a filter and get good tuning. At lower Rpm when it blows back into the carb and in the air filter the next intake is all the more rich because the air in the air filter is already saturated with gas. Then at real high rpms the filter doesn't seem to keep up with air demand--------19mm Dellorto

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Try a larger carb 19/21 dell, match the intake to the cylinder, then buy a homoet or other nicer pipe. You get what ya pay for.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Pablo Puchasso /

K-Stars, DMP's, and TCCD's are kinda naturally rattle-y. Just loud kits like Andrew says.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

wow, thanks for all the response, all the love, all the ideas.

andrew:

roffman modded the air filter for more flow, its flowin the flow

jesse:

someday i will pony up to 19 del and a different pipe, either a motomatic or some other custom jobber

steve:

dude thank you for explaining what i knew but did not know why.... i mean that the carb needs a little restriction in order to operate to its full potential

orange robin

i paid 30 for the pipe. feel like i'm getting my moneys worth.

paid 75 for the kit with the head, shipped.

in fact, other than new gaskets, some other brand new parts that roffman threw in, and by the way the clutch is fucking perfect damn he set it up good, everything for this build (except for ped itself and the engine) was purchased used on the buy/sell forum. i'm not gonna add it all up, it wouldn't sound right.

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Yea chris I got 3000 Miles out of my e50

70cc k-star

boss pipe

19mm phbg

red molassi filter

40 idle

w9 needle on the leanest setting

87 main jet!

dmp unstuffed crank! And the Roller bearing was what caused the death of this klt! I will now be changing my roller bearings after every 6 months!

16X40 Gearing also! I live in Sw florida so Jetting is really fucked here!

Running Gila now!

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

gila is my next kit. i'm gonna build another e50, with a gila, and that's gonna go on my magnum, i'm gonna put this current setup on my fiance's maxi i'm building for her. she's gonna have the purtiest bike in cleveland

Re: critique my setup : 70 kstar etc

Ϫ‡☄ಬ∞ ƀƖḬƝƊ ƤǂƿƎ ∞ಬ☄‡Ϫ - Hoke from Black Pipes Moped Gang /

so update. after 3 weeks of breaking in the kit, alot of the rattlyness has gone away. switched to a 17t up front and now the clutch grabs at 22-24 mph, pipe starts hitting before the clutch grabs, really hits hard at 32 till 45, then you have to "finesse" it to i think 48 or so on the flats. plug chops are pretty useless, but when i pulled the plug to check for leaks/oilyness/etc it looked pretty good. while i was breaking it in, i varied the throttle position ALOT, hopefully to avoid giving it any flat spots. the other day i gave it its first long ride, 30 miles to medina and back, the last 3-4 miles were 45 mph roads, i held WOT for at least 3 miles, and said "fuck it if it breaks it breaks" but damn so far so good.

it seems to me, if you have the proma circuit, you can gear it out for higher top speed and if you tune the clutch correctly, you won't be missing alot of your low end. even with the 17t x 40 gearing i am still able to get up some hills from a dead stop with minimal clutch burnage.

thanks to everyone, all the advice givers, all the blasters, especially to roffman for the experienced tuning advice and setup.

here is the bike as it sits today:

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