Re: New cars are shit

> Jimmy Cincinnati Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> I dont like the idea of the government dedicating what kind of cars

> we are allowed to drive.

>

We already do!

Re: New cars are shit

The vehicles are not the problem, it is the drivers, penalties for violations are nowhere near tough enough nor are the most basic rules of the road enforced as they should be. Not nearly enough or rigorous enough training for new drivers.

Re: New cars are shit

^This is true!

Re: New cars are shit

__̴ı̴̴̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡*̡̡ ̴̡ı̴̴̡ ̡̡͡|̲̲̲͡͡͡ ̲▫̲͡ ̲͡ ̲̲̲͡͡π̲̲͡͡ ̲̲͡▫̲̲͡͡ ̲|̡̡̡ ̡ ̴̡ı̴̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡̡.__ /

suv lmfao

yawl are fools. keep buying throw away cars.

Re: New cars are shit

kevin Smellaflange /

that would solve a of problems...a chip in the plate that governs speed & heads & such.

but then your in a a wifi, track, slot car, type of roadway.

no more freedom to be an in and out of court paying whatever fine you caused, to help with fines $$$$ lol

Re: New cars are shit

Robots...……..robot kids are growing up! LOL!

Re: New cars are shit

Check out survavability and crash test ratings on the small cars. Sure like crash a geo metro and you're dead as fuck but the new ones do actually quite well. Even the tiny boys are better than most anything youd get 20 years ago just with proper crumple and ensuring the engine goes down instead of in w/ head ons, side curtain airbags etc

And they arent actually that bad to work on, they're just different- yeah maybe you gotta take the bumper off to get to the radiator or something, but if so, the bumpers designed to come off in like 20 minutes of you know what you're doing. Brakes and tires etc are all no more complicated than ever. I guess it's easy to be intimidated by efi vs carburetor but if you're talking 80s cars, efi is a billion times easier than a 50 hose vacuum assisted spaghetti pile carburetor.

Like in mopeds people rag on how difficult French bikes are, but it's not so much that they're difficult- just different. So if you're used to other bikes nobody wants to relearn shit.

Also all the shit that's extras and could break like backup cameras and sunroof or electric windows or cruise control, for the most part if that shit does break whatever. Car still works, you just have to look behind you when reversing again or whatever.

Honestly one o my biggest gripe with alotta modern whips is shit visibility, windows are smaller, narrower. Especially SUVs. Probably for safety reasons, but I dont love it

Re: New cars are shit

> Born to be WillD Wrote:

> And they arent actually that bad to work on, they're just different-

> yeah maybe you gotta take the bumper off to get to the radiator or

> something, but if so, the bumpers designed to come off in like 20

> minutes of you know what you're doing. Brakes and tires etc are all no

> more complicated than ever. I guess it's easy to be intimidated by efi

> vs carburetor but if you're talking 80s cars, efi is a billion times

> easier than a 50 hose vacuum assisted spaghetti pile carburetor.

This doesn't sound like you've done much work on new or old cars.

Things are more difficult to repair on a new car:

Spark plugs on old cars are generally easy VS Stripping aluminum heads on new cars.

A/C compressors and Evaporators are at least 20 to 30 times more difficult to replace on new cars than old cars.

I've worked on Transverse mount modern sedans where the serpentine belt was so difficult to remove I might as well have been working on a Ferrari

New Cars and their computer controlled plastic gear actuated climate control systems. Programmers and blend door motors are new and break all the time and are hell to fix.

HEAD GASKETS--- The old cars with cast iron heads won't blow them...New cars will due to prominent design flaws??? WTF? Manufacturers build this crap??

TRANSMISSION--- Not only are they much harder to remove and replace in a new car, but they can't be reliably rebuilt due to so many revisions and yearly updates. . You end up spending retard money on some shitty 40k limited warranty rebuild...but more often than not the shitmobile hits the junkyard.

Meanwhile older cars have much easier to remove transmissions and they can be rebuilt fairly cheaply and often can even be upgraded as well.

Fuel pumps on older cars were a matter of 4 bolts on the front of the engine vs. in tank fuel pump.. much easier on the old car.

Also the vacuum lines on old cars may be long, but it is simple to learn their functions and where they all go... I've redone them on several older Cadillacs.

I understand fuel injection is better, and I have no problem with it, but everything has to be serviceable and no plastic cam sensor interupter magnet holders!!

Crank sensors suck on new cars and they end up costing the consumer

Window motors and power seat components are really shitty on new cars and are often hell to fix. . meanwhile find an old car from the 1970s and more often than not the power window motors are original and still work!! The quality tanked in the 1980s.

The fact that I can add to this list easily and keep going really makes me think you haven't done much auto work on both newer and older cars. .

Re: New cars are shit

Jimmy Cincinnati /

I guess it's easy to be intimidated by efi vs carburetor but if you're talking 80s cars, efi is a billion times easier than a 50 hose vacuum assisted spaghetti pile carburetor.

Ill give Born some credit on this... not sure what the hell they were thinking with vacuum operated carbs. Chevy didnt want that crap to die either. Wait... Chevy = Motobecane??? Illuminati confirmed!

Re: New cars are shit

Distributor, airflap, a/c controls, etc. It's really not that bad....

I fully understand fuel injection, but hate it due to the placement of components

If you can't figure out the vacuum lines or think it it difficult try pulling a bad ecm out of the dash.... or have fun pulling the gas tank to do the pump...

It just doesn't add up...even with the fuel lines it is much easier to repair than the new stuff.

Re: New cars are shit

Chöschi21 C.K. /

I can say, it's actually not really harder to repair stuff on newer Trucks than it is on older, for instance, look at the old Mercedes SK Trucks, V6 Turbodiesel Engine, and the new Mercedes Actros MP4's, if you want to change the Cluch and there is a Structure on the Back of it, most of the times it's easier to just pull out the Engine, it is way easier on the MP4 from 2014-now compared to the older SK from '89-98 it also is(Obviously) easier to swap out the Air Bags for the Suspension, compared to Leaf Springs, but then again, we still don't know how many Kilometers the newer ones will hold up, the older MP3's with V6 and V8 engines can do 1'000'000km and still run strong, of course, some of them fail before, waiting to find out how long the newer I6 Engines hold up.

Had to add this in too, i like the idea of mounting no Mirrors on a Truck and use Cameras, but i think it will be worse for Cyclists and Moped Riders.(edited)

Re: New cars are shit

I could get an old mercedes 1970s diesel car and drive it to work and back for years fairly cheap......

If I went to run a 1990s mercedes it would likely be gas and horribly expensive and difficult to maintain..

So maybe mercedes over there stayed high quality, idk not the case here.

Re: New cars are shit

> Thomas Davis Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Born to be WillD Wrote:

>

> > And they arent actually that bad to work on, they're just different-

>

> > yeah maybe you gotta take the bumper off to get to the radiator or

>

> > something, but if so, the bumpers designed to come off in like 20

>

> > minutes of you know what you're doing. Brakes and tires etc are all no

>

> > more complicated than ever. I guess it's easy to be intimidated by efi

>

> > vs carburetor but if you're talking 80s cars, efi is a billion times

>

> > easier than a 50 hose vacuum assisted spaghetti pile carburetor.

>

> This doesn't sound like you've done much work on new or old cars.

>

> Things are more difficult to repair on a new car:

>

> Spark plugs on old cars are generally easy VS Stripping aluminum heads

> on new cars.

>

> A/C compressors and Evaporators are at least 20 to 30 times more

> difficult to replace on new cars than old cars.

>

> I've worked on Transverse mount modern sedans where the serpentine belt

> was so difficult to remove I might as well have been working on a

> Ferrari

>

> New Cars and their computer controlled plastic gear actuated climate

> control systems. Programmers and blend door motors are new and break all

> the time and are hell to fix.

>

> HEAD GASKETS--- The old cars with cast iron heads won't blow them...New

> cars will due to prominent design flaws??? WTF? Manufacturers build this

> crap??

>

> TRANSMISSION--- Not only are they much harder to remove and replace in a

> new car, but they can't be reliably rebuilt due to so many revisions and

> yearly updates. . You end up spending retard money on some shitty 40k

> limited warranty rebuild...but more often than not the shitmobile hits

> the junkyard.

>

> Meanwhile older cars have much easier to remove transmissions and they

> can be rebuilt fairly cheaply and often can even be upgraded as well.

>

> Fuel pumps on older cars were a matter of 4 bolts on the front of the

> engine vs. in tank fuel pump.. much easier on the old car.

>

> Also the vacuum lines on old cars may be long, but it is simple to learn

> their functions and where they all go... I've redone them on several

> older Cadillacs.

>

> I understand fuel injection is better, and I have no problem with it,

> but everything has to be serviceable and no plastic cam sensor

> interupter magnet holders!!

>

> Crank sensors suck on new cars and they end up costing the consumer

>

> Window motors and power seat components are really shitty on new cars

> and are often hell to fix. . meanwhile find an old car from the 1970s

> and more often than not the power window motors are original and still

> work!! The quality tanked in the 1980s.

>

> The fact that I can add to this list easily and keep going really makes

> me think you haven't done much auto work on both newer and older cars. .

There IS no comparison,older repairs to newer car repairs. Done a lot of em,not even close. An older car, in most cases can be overhauled, and transmission replaced(I'm talking RWD here) SO easily.

Wheel bearin gs,ball joints,no aluminum to worry about bending,etc. No comparison . Ford,Chevy,Chrysler,and the foreign junkers do NOT want the common guy to be able to repair their cars.

I hav e a 2-post lift. Without it, forget my even trying to do some jobs on the newer FWD models.

Re: New cars are shit

Thank you Don. . It's crazy how the guy thought newer cars are easier to work on.. he must have heard it and not experienced it all himself.

Re: New cars are shit

Just getting the computer out of my Lincoln LSes requires the dash removed and is a pain. Just LOOKING at changing a timing belt o these idiotic FWDs gives me a knot in my stomach. LOL!

No reason for such stupidity except you've got pointy-headed engineers devising stuff to keep the back yard guys hands away from it and the dealers get the profits.

Next year I intend to install a 2-post lift here in FL also. I sure miss it when I'm away from Ohio.

Re: New cars are shit

I never said they were easier, just that some things ARE easier and it's incorrect to blanket dismiss new cars as inherently worse or more difficult. basically what I said was you're lazy luddite old boners who can't adapt to change and wanna be downers on everything. Seems I forgot you know everything and you certainly know my experience and oh boy it's a whole lot less than yours. I can take the alternator out of my wife's new 2016 accord in 15 minutes. I spent 3 hours trying to weasel an alternator out of an old 80's maxima. I can completely remove the head in a hour, no more complicated than old cars. the front bumper comes out and in half a day you could slide the whole motor straight out the front. but I don't need to.

dammit. you got me again. bums me out i'm so easily suckered into your negativity. Why can't we ever disagree without some asshat getting all "i'm smarter than you and you know nothing" and turning shit into a total crap fest.

Re: New cars are shit

You're comparing 1980s imports to new vehicles today, lol.

If you have to remove a head on a new car then that car is garbage anyways and you've just proved my point which is new cars are shit.

And you do realize that we're talking about overall ease of serviceability....

You can cherry pick a few things that may be easier on a new car to service and it may make you feel all warm and fuzzy..

But the fact remains new cars are shit and are more difficult to work on.

Re: New cars are shit

Also this quote......"And they arent actually that bad to work on, they're just different"

Read again

And they arent actually that bad to work on, they're just different

And they arent actually that bad to work on, they're just different

And they arent actually that bad to work on, they're just different

BULLSHIT!

No one who has done real work on old and new cars would say such nonsense.

Re: New cars are shit

T.D. nailed it again. Ever looked at replacing a power steering pump on a 2005 Chrysler Minivan? Oh yeah, there's a trick to it they don't want you to know.Take it to the Dealer,they'll say.

BUT youtube has ONE video that tells how to save yer sanity while doing it. At the end of it,he says `YOU'RE WELCOME' because he knows how many have suffered or are about to suffer,but won't because of his advice.

When you have to go to YOU TUBE to repair a modern car,that says it all. Modern cars are stupidly engineered by pointy-headed geeks.

Re: New cars are shit

Jimmy Cincinnati /

When you have to go to YOU TUBE to repair a modern car,that says it all. Modern cars are stupidly engineered by pointy-headed geeks.

Lets change this thread to how awesome youtube is. I have figured out many issues thanks to youtube.

Re: New cars are shit

The New Cars Are Shit and Youtube is Awesome Thread, lol

Re: New cars are shit

The mere fact that `you tube' is necessary for us to repair these ugly ,farcical newer cars settles any argument about ease of repair.

Re: New cars are shit

> Thomas Davis Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Yes, planned obsolence. The cars from 2000s on are are ugly and built to

> be shit in a junkyard.

>

> Count me out. I want an easy to get to and easily rebuildable

> engine/transmission. I don't want year to year variations and I don't

> want any plastic parts in the engine or transmission.

>

> I don't want a plastic intake, hell I don't even want an aluminum

> intake, cast iron is the way to go, and no coolant running through it

> either. Exhaust heated or non heated intakes are the way to go.

>

> Aluminum heads belong on race cars only as do 200degree plus

> thermostats, especially when running a piece of shit paper thin plastic

> radiator and plastic fan witn a chinese made motor. Also plugs should be

> able to be changed without stripping and valve seats should never drop!

>

> Head gaskets that fail due to poor design should not be tolerated, yet

> the dbags live with it and try and upgrade it by using different studs

> and such......nonsense fucking nonsense... what total shit.

>

> Electronics should be limited and easily serviceable, no a/c actuators

> buried in the dash or sensors or programmers or ecus. They could put

> them under the dash but make sure it's easy to get to. Once again the

> shitters don't care.

>

> Multi coil ignition systems are great but don't use plastics within the

> engine to make it happen. Fuel injection is fine, but stick with

> sequential. Variable valve timing, overhead cams with plastic tensioners

> and other modern junk won't last for generations and will send a slew of

> shittermobiles to the junkyard.

Wow, your brain is really stuck in the early 80's. Aluminum heads (and intakes) don't affect reliability, very few cars nowadays have head gasket design issues, COP systems are infinitely better than distributor style ignitions, fuel injection has been ironed out for the last 35 years (I will say though that DI has a tendency to become problematic with some mileage), variable valve timing has no inherent issues while allowing the engine to have a much broader powerband with higher overall total power numbers and less emissions, DOHC is superior for airflow and velocity and overall power characteristics while being much easier on the valve train and chain tensioners nowadays often last the life of the vehicle.

I like old shit as much as the next guy (I'm on a moped forum for Christ's sake) but lets not pretend that 90% of the tech on cars nowadays doesn't make owning and maintaining a vehicle much easier while overall making a lot more power with better MPG's.

Re: New cars are shit

Ok modern car fanboy.... I'm not stuck in the 1980s ...aluminum heads fuck up so much over and over headgaskets blow and spark plugs strip out......

Fuel injection is fine as long as components are accessible including ecm!

Ohc is often built with shit plastic parts and sometimes rubber timing belts....all of which don't age well and will send the car to the junkyard once it gets near 20years or so which is the lifespan of a modern shit mobile.

So ya, new cars suck and fanboys are dumb.(edited)

Re: New cars are shit

> Thomas Davis Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Ok modern car fanboy.... I'm not stuck in the 1980s ...aluminum heads

> fuck up so much over and over headgaskets blow and spark plugs strip

> out......

>

> Fuel injection is fine as long as components are accessible including

> ecm!

>

> Ohc is often built with shit plastic parts and sometimes rubber timing

> belts....all of which don't age well and will send the car to the

> junkyard once it gets near 20years or so which is the lifespan of a

> modern shit mobile.

>

> So ya, new cars suck and fanboys are dumb.

Yes, I like new cars just like I like old cars, hardly a "new car fanboy" (like that's a bad thing?), they're just objectively better nowadays. Rubber timing belts are for dampening harmonic vibration, there's a reason OEM's use them. They're also generally easier to change when the time comes as well as being quieter in operation. Spark plugs only strip out aluminum threads if you're retarded and just keep tightening with no regard to the material you're working with, personally I've never pulled plug threads (or any other threads) on aluminum anything, nor blown any head gaskets either. Maybe you should stick to old cast shit if you can't comprehend how a torque wrench works or think that changing a timing belt every 100k is beyond your ability and "will send a car to the junkyard".

Every engine I've had within the last 10 years (old and new) has had at least an aluminum head(s) and I've had no trouble with any of them and they were all fairly high strung engines.

Re: New cars are shit

Anecdotal evidence does not constitute data!

Who cares about your single experience.. millions of new cars blow head gaskets and stripped plugs generally occur when removing them.....

And that crappy rubber timing chain is a maintainence requirement that the old cars lack......

Lol it balances the engine....old v8s run smoother without that nonsense!!

Not to mention ride quality which I haven't even touched on....new cars ride like shit!

No more nice and cushiony ride,.now it's all racing type sport handling that jostles and shakes the occupants around when encountering any kind of bump.....but ya can corner at high speeds....hurr durrrr...

New cars are shit and are meant to be thrown in the junkyard!! You just don't understand because you haven't worked much on both.

Re: New cars are shit

> Thomas Davis Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Anecdotal evidence does not constitute data!

>

> Who cares about your single experience.. millions of new cars blow head

> gaskets and stripped plugs generally occur when removing them.....

>

> And that crappy rubber timing chain is a maintainence requirement that

> the old cars lack......

>

> Lol it balances the engine....old v8s run smoother without that

> nonsense!!

>

> Not to mention ride quality which I haven't even touched on....new cars

> ride like shit!

>

> No more nice and cushiony ride,.now it's all racing type sport handling

> that jostles and shakes the occupants around when encountering any kind

> of bump.....but ya can corner at high speeds....hurr durrrr...

>

> New cars are shit and are meant to be thrown in the junkyard!! You just

> don't understand because you haven't worked much on both.

I was actually a tech for a while before I stopped, didn't like breaking my back day in and day out. Your anecdotal experience doesn't constitute anything either, ask any old timer mechanic that's actually kept up with the times what's better, new vs. old, they'll tell you you don't need to do anything to new cars maintenance-wise because there's nothing to do anymore, all the techs at my dealership complain that there's no work because newer cars just don't have anything you need to do to them. No more valve adjustments, decarbonizing combustion chambers, resetting timing, tuning carbs, head jobs every 50k, spark plugs every 3rd oil change, no more distributor, points or spark plug wires to keep maintained, etc. Old cars are generally junk that you have to keep on top of 24/7 to keep em running right. They usually have more character and are fun to work on (which you'll be doing a lot of) but that's not what gets a vehicle from point A to point B. Trust, I've built a few and worked in old school shops.

I also didn't say timing belts balance the engine, I said it dampens harmonic vibration. Do you understand what that means? It's ok if you don't, you don't seem to understand the basics as it is, or maybe that's all you understand? I mean, when you compared doing a belt change on a transverse engine to working on a Ferrari it showed your skillset right there lol.

Also, I happened to own a couple of those "old V8s", old SBC's and nowadays own its modern equivalent, an LS2. The LS2 is all aluminum, COP, fuel injected with a plastic intake on stock aluminum heads and my particular one makes about 500hp on pump gas, gets 26-27mpg highway and is reliable and streetable. That old boat anchor SBC would have hell getting it to those power levels (you probably couldn't without aftermarket aluminum heads) and if you did it wouldn't be streetable or get even half the MPG's, nor would it be considered any type of reliable.

I'd like to see your data on millions of cars blowing head gaskets and stripping plugs, from the sound of it it's just you not knowing how to work on an engine.

I don't know why I'm arguing with an idiot though, no matter what is said you'll still hold on to your 40 year old beliefs. That's ok, I'll enjoy my much better vehicles and 40+ years of engine development while you're on the side of the road trying to troubleshoot that old POS.(edited)

Re: New cars are shit

Sparks plugs strip when removing them... You can't grasp that fact... How am I an idiot and you can't understand the fucking things weld themselves into the head??

A tech lol, not a mechanic.

Power....who cares...

And yes, fucking tons of new cars blowing head gaskets left and right. It's due to shitty aluminum heads.

And rubber timing belts are garbage no matter how you try and sell it.

Fuck dampening the new car motors aren't as smooth as older carbureted v8s.

And you just glossed over the fact the new cars ride like shit, lol

And how many times do I have to tell you you don't pull the head off an old car at some random interval on an old car?

Distributors and plug wires aren't that big of a deal and don't go out that often....fucking coil on plugs that's made of brittle plastic ya, that's the garbage.

You just keep trying to convince yourself you know what you're talking about techie, lol.

Re: New cars are shit

My Dad's 289 cu.in. 1966 Ford Custom(State car) went 235,000 miles with no engine work at all. I broke the frame on it pulling an RV trailer when I hit a bunch of deep potholes on a Cincinnati on ramp during the 76 Blizzard.

Oh,yes, I wish it would have had an electronic ignition, like in the later 70s. But that was a later invention and not needed,since points went 15K or more.

My Falcon went way over 225,000, probably near 300K with no motor work .

Now you give THOSE engines the superior air filters,oil filters and OIL(synthetic) we have now and they would make a liar out of your claims that aluminum is better tnhan cast. LOL!

P.S.: They ALSO had to run bias ply tires. Gas mileage robbery there.

Re: New cars are shit

Chöschi21 C.K. /

> Thomas Davis Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> I could get an old mercedes 1970s diesel car and drive it to work and

> back for years fairly cheap......

>

> If I went to run a 1990s mercedes it would likely be gas and horribly

> expensive and difficult to maintain..

>

> So maybe mercedes over there stayed high quality, idk not the case here.

I am Talkig ablut the bigger Trucks, anso, i don't think you get the Base Model Mercedes Cars, right?

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