So what peds can be push started ??

Looking at that thread .. "Crazy Euro peds" .. it looks like many have had their pedals removed.

How do they start these bikes ?

(Puch Maxi and Piaggio Ciao)

Can you push start them like my PA50 ?

I don't think Tomo's can be push started.

My FA50 can't be push started.

(assuming a person can only run about 5mph when pushing a ped)

Anybody know ??

Re: So what peds can be push started ??

Fred,

I'd assume any Batavus with the M48 engine can be push started. That's how I start mine. I actually "skateboard" it. I stand with my left foot one the left peddle and push alone with the right foot until "m moving fast enough to coast with some degree of stability, and then I "pop" the clutch and start her up. I have yet to start it by actually riding it like a bike.

Richard

Re: So what peds can be push started ??

ItsLookingUp /

Fred, the Ciao is started by riding, there is no kick or electric start.

Re: So what peds can be push started ??

My puch needs to be brought up to exactly 8 miles an hour to start it, which I do by running next to it and then jumping on. I had to put pegs on when the pedals broke.

Re: So what peds can be push started ??

jawa 210's can be pushed started

Re: So what peds can be push started ??

chuck risso va /

i used to have to push start my mk2 cuz the pedal chain broke, i would pop the clutch after about 5-10 feet and it started right up

Re: So what peds can be push started ??

ItsLookingUp wrote:

>

> Fred, the Ciao is started by riding, there is no kick or

> electric start.

That makes no sense .. you mean they start by PEDALING ??

The bikes that made me ask this appear to have had their pedals removed ...

So you CAN't start by pedaling....

... and do you REALLY think I thought they had electric or kick starts ?????????

........ the question was stated rather specifically in the post title ...

Re: So what peds can be push started ??

Fred, you can run start a puch, and a ciao.....

Re: Vespas

They have a starter clutch that engages when the rear wheel gets up to the right speed.

Opening the compression release to lets the engine "spin" prior to starting. You CAN "kickstart" a Vespa by holding the compression release and pressing down hard on the pedal that is in the up position.

The Solex supposedly can only be started by pedalling, but I've started mine by spinning the front wheel by hand.

Jim

Re: Vespas

Matt Wilson /

My peugeot 103 was very easy to start with a decompression lever pulled. I could just push off and it would start up.

Same with my old sachs with a decompression it would start from walking speed.

To start my puch I really needed to go about 8mph or so, like toehead mentioned.

At least from my experiance if it has a decompression cable you can push start from walking speed. If not than it takes some more effort

So what peds can be push started ??

i think pretty much any moped i've seen can be push started. that's especially true for ones w/ pedals (not sure about tomos, though, since you pedal it backwards to start it).

all pedaling does is turn the rear wheel. if you push the bike, you're essentially doing the same thing. just use the decompression or starter/clutch lever the same way as if pedaling and start it up. it's just like an old motorcycle (which if i remember right, you can also push start).

i often push start my vespa grande just because the pedal arms are a little warped and pedaling is difficult.

So what peds can be push started ??

to answer your question specifically ... the following engines can be push started (please add more if you know):

minarelli

morini

garelli

vespa-piaggio

puch

sachs

batavus

motobecane

pugeut

Tomos can, sort of..

You'd have to run very very fast, however.

Fred and I discovered that if you tow a Tomos, as soon as it hits second-gear level of speed, the engine will engage.

But I can't see anyone run-starting one that way.

If you have a steep enough hill, you can do so, however.

-T

Yeah but

... yeah but that was with the spark plug out and being towed by another ped .. at about 12mph the Tomos started turning over... (but the plug was out).

So who knows what speed it would take to get it to turn over with the plug in ??

I am glad to hear all those other peds will push start .. thats the way things should be .. like motorcycles ..

.. Even with dead batteries on electric start m-cycles they'll start with a serious push or slight downhill.

You'd be stranded otherwise.

I love push starting my PA .. thats the only way I've started it for years now .. decomp lever and 2 or 3 quick steps and you're off.

No muss no fuss no pedals.

Probably won't work on ice though.

Re: Yeah but

you don't really have to run very fast at all to push start a bike. just enough to overcome the resistence from the clutch.

on my vespa grande, sometimes i just sit on it and push on the ground w/ my feet (more walking than running) and it starts up. and that's after sitting a full day or two.

on minarelli or puch or similar mopeds, you can just stand next to the bike, take a quick 2-3 steps, pull the starter lever, and usually by the time you jump on the seat and let go of the clutch, it's already fired up. if i'm in a hurry, i push start my bike (like chasing some moped thieves). it takes a bit more energy than the relaxed pedal-start, but its quicker and you get more top speed sooner. dan always run starts his mopeds before racing them.

a well-tuned bike w/ a good clutch cable will start up push starting w/in a 3-4 yards.

also ... you can push start:

tomos

kreidler

derbi

honda pa50/hobit

mopeds with verona, califo engines

Sure about that ?

Do you know people who HAVE started Tomos's by push starting ?

you also ae describing bikes with "clutch cables like they all have them... they do not... Tomos' and Hondas do not have manually activated starter clutches or clutch cables.

And its not 'the resistance of the clutch' you are overcoming... its the remainder of the compression left after pushing the decomp lever.. and the frictional resistance of internal parts you are overcoming.

Thats why I say you can't push start a Tomos ... no decomp and no 'starter clutch'.

Re: Yeah but

motorcycles start when u ride them down a hill??

Re: Yeah but

Starting an electric-start motorcycle with a dead battery >

You're on a hill.

Set the choke for whatever the weather conditions/motor warmth is.

Bike in neutral.

Give a good 3 step (or more) push downhill.

Hop on.

Wait till speed gets high enough .. (bout 10mph minimum)

Clutch in.

Push gear lever down into 1st or up into 2nd.

Let out clutch and the motor will fire off .. give throttle as necessary.

You're not stranded ... (don't stall it at the bottom of a hill though .. unless you like pushing it up hills)

BTDT

Re: Yeah but

By the way .. the same goes for manual transmission cars.

(bring the football team to help push if you're not on a hill)

Re: Yeah but

aactually .. if the battery is totally dead .. I don't think most cars ignition systems will work.

(all this applies to older non-computerized non-fuel injected motors .. I can't say about those newer ones)

Re: Yeah but

I don't think the problem is the computers but the fact that an alternator, having no internal magnets, needs a small electrical charge from the battery to create the magnetic field. No magnetic field and no pwer genterated. Simple test: get any early 1970's car with an alternator (no computers here) and pull out the battery. See if it can be push started.

Richard

Sure about that ?

ok, fred, yeah, you got me. it's not really a "clutch" lever/cable or anything like that. but most people use that term, so i just use it also.

either way, you know what i'm talking about. and you can easily start most any moped by push-starting it.

and yes, i've seen people push start a tomos. the older ones, mind you, not the newer ones. it took about 10 yards, but it went. and that was actually up a very slight incline.

Re: Yeah but

Skunk Boy /

I had a Ford Pinto that would start from complete dead, it took 2-3 runs and pops of the clutch, but it would start, and it was completly dead, no lights, no clicks, no beep from the door being open.

I had Tomos that would start like that

If you got it rolling fast enough, it would pop off...

I'd do it heading out of my old 'hood sometimes so I wouldn't wake the neighbors with that loud ass exhaust I used to have...

12-15mph.

>>So who knows what speed it would take to get it to turn over with the plug in ??<<

I think it's about the same, I had one stall out at Rte2 once by the Rte10 exit, and when trying to kickstart it, that damn U-clip popped and then all I got was clickety noises when trying to kick it over.

So, I pointed her down that big hill by the cemetary and pedaled for all I was worth to get a little way on, and as I recall at about 12-15 mph she turned over, starting and thankfully gettin me home so I could take the damn transmission apart.

Can be done, but it's sure not easy, and requires a pretty big hill, at least in my experience.

-T

Re: Yeah but

Was it an alternator or a generator setup. I had a 1961 Chevy Bel-Air with a generator. I could start it going downhill with no problem with no battery. Generators and alternators are not the same thing.

Richard

Shoulda been titled .....

Looks like I should've titled this post ... "What mopeds CAN"T be push started ?"

Because almost any of the pedal ones can from the sounds of it.

And it looks like most of the Jap peds CAN"T be push started .. because most of them don't have pedal systems.

Miguel .. do you realize how rare all those peds you stated are ?

All those Euro peds ?

I swear I have never seen MOST of those brand names in person.

I would guess they are fairly common in college towns maybe ...(from students in the past with little money needing cheap transport .. and restrictions on who can own cars at many colleges).

But outside of college and resort towns ..all those Italian and other Euro peds ... they are just not very common at all.

Re: Shoulda been titled .....

you can push starta puegeot... infact when i first started messing with mine.. I would use a rope tied to my pickup and my girlfreind would tow me around becuase I htought if i got it fast enough it would eventual start up.. this was before it was fixed././ later Id di it becuase I was lazy.

My 2 speed manual shift is the same way.. you can

Pop the Clucth if you stall out while riding and it start up instantly...

Re: Shoulda been titled .....

I think you're right Fred- the Jap peds are everywhere.

I decided that the ONLY ped I will pass on is a Honda express- and just so happens, I've come across A TON OF THEM.

One guy even had an express, an Indian (moped, not for sale) and a strange little suzuki moped-looking scooter. He wanted over $400 for any of them, and I had to pass.

Re: Yeah but

Skunk Boy /

It was an alternator, I had to replace it when I rebuilt the motor.

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