There seem to be a lot of pretty cheap, 20-30 dollar Dellorto SHA "style" Carburetors on ebay. They are about half the price of the real thing, I wanted to know if any of you guys have used them and if they are any good.
My gut tells me no, but I figured I would ask anyway.
Also I imagine they cant be as bad as my current carb... the very popular bing encarwi so I figured this might be a good temporary upgrade?
If anyone has bought and used them let me know, also how are the cone air filters?
why a temporary upgrade?
get this so ya dont have to drop the engine to tune your carb
get a real Dellorto SHA, a decent airfilter, a cheap pipe, and you could be doing 30-35mph and retain reliability
They're kinda shitty, about like the bing ones off ebay. The only reason to buy one is maybe to rob parts to fix an og del.
> Full Tuck Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> why a temporary upgrade?
>
> get this so ya dont have to drop the engine to tune your carb
>
> get a real Dellorto SHA, a decent airfilter, a cheap pipe, and you could
> be doing 30-35mph and retain reliability
Temporary because its not a real dellorto and I havent decided if I want to keep my bullet stock or kit it but the current bing in it suuucks
I also dont understand why this simple piece of pipe is 55 dollars.
Maybe im lucky in that I have a family member that does metal fabrication with a full shop of tools at my disposal but I just cant justify dropping 55 dollars on this. I'll just make my own.
MLM doesnt have mass-production scale. everything is hand made. clean welds, flat surfaces, powder coated, made+designed in USA, etc
I've made intakes out of stock exhaust headers and then spigot mounted a carburetor. sure, i saved money on the intake, but it was ugly and i spent alot of time messing with it to make it work.
its a balance of time and money. i used to have the time and a garage, now i don't; so i plan it all out before i even turn a wrench.
if you're gonna stick with stock or 50cc, 15mm carb and intake is perfect. if you want a kit, best to go up to 18mm-21mm... but you cant really tune a carb that big on a stock A3. plan now and buy only once.
> Full Tuck Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> MLM doesnt have mass-production scale. everything is hand made. clean
> welds, flat surfaces, powder coated, made+designed in USA, etc
>
> I've made intakes out of stock exhaust headers and then spigot mounted a
> carburetor. sure, i saved money on the intake, but it was ugly and i
> spent alot of time messing with it to make it work.
>
> its a balance of time and money. i used to have the time and a garage,
> now i don't; so i plan it all out before i even turn a wrench.
>
> if you're gonna stick with stock or 50cc, 15mm carb and intake is
> perfect. if you want a kit, best to go up to 18mm-21mm... but you cant
> really tune a carb that big on a stock A3. plan now and buy only once.
Thats understandable for people that dont have the time or space to do stuff like this.
I was considering a this kit that comes with everything but the exhaust. Price seems reasonable.
https://www.dennycycles.com/tomos-a3-44mm-speed-kit-version-3/
no
> Toledo Riot Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> no
I enjoy straight forward answers.
I was in your same scenario with my Batavus. I bought the knock off carb on eBay and had a buddy fab me up a larger intake. It’s not rocket science, those guys selling for $50 are doing the same thing. Find 15mm steel pipe and weld it to a piece of traced metal.
My bike has much more power than before, it was a turd with the stock carb.
Only tip if getting the knock off carb would be to disassemble, clean, and inspect it before use.
I bought the 14.12mm just to play it safe since I’m keeping bike mainly stock. Most likely you will need new throttle cable also. There is also a good spreadsheet on tuning, and what guys have done to specific bikes on this website. That way you can pick and chose mods based on what you are shooting for.
PS. Don’t let your buddies try to bully you for not buying genuine lol (edited)
Ebay clone carbs are hard to tune and jets may not fit. Bad choice.
Good parts cost money, not a lot of money but spend the extra 20-30 on a good carb or you’ll be running in circles.
Don’t be mismatch swapping parts if you don’t wanna change everything you want at once, I’ve found that you spend the least time with a headache and more time riding if you swap the kit, carb, pipe and CDI if you go that route all at the same time. That way you can tune everything to a fresh top end, time it, jet it, gear it and get on the road.
No silly clone parts unless you’re just gonna steal small parts off of them.
The amount of time and labor you’re gonna spend cutting, drilling, shaping, powder coating an intake (plus the cost of materials and tools) Personally id just look for a used one if you’re not in a rush, if I am it’s worth the extra 20$ to be able to get the project back on the road.
There’s always someone who can find something cheaper, but it’s not always worth the time... especially if you wanna just enjoy a good moped ride.
Clone SHAs get a ton of hate but it's all in how you actually tune the carb. I've had fantastic results with the Runtong brand carb, they're $15 from Chinese Ebay if you're willing to wait a month or two and there's other things you can fix up in the meantime.
I almost exclusively use them to fix the moped flip projects I do. Why pay $50+ for something that's 50 plus years old and has less moving parts than a chainsaw carburetor and is still made of the same cheap pot metal and sloppy QC from back in the day?
That being said the Dellorto PHBG clones and Mikuni VM clones are not as good quality since there's far more moving parts in them to go wrong. Given there's only one moving part with the SHA with nothing attached to it, it works just fine.
Also, the Chinese Dellorto jets fit them and they're aggressively cheaper than the jets someone slapped a brand name on to make them $20+ more money.
If you're stuck on the idea of a brand name carb, get a Mikuni. Far better design and far better quality.
As you can see, everyone has a different opinion on this. If you’re flipping bikes it’s a different story, especially if you wanna wait 2 months for a 30 dollar part.
Definitely nothing to do with “paying for the name” don’t know anyone who doesn’t ride a 40 year old moped who knows the dellorto name.
I feel strongly about these clone carbs because i’ve gone through at least 4 of them, all of them either didn’t seal right, came with uneven mating surfaces, and one of them even had a piece of the casting jammed into the atomizer. I tend to only buy bikes I plan on keeping these days, in my experience the knockoffs have been a 0/10 rating.
Also if you’re kitting your bike and if you’re smart you will buy a temp gauge if you plan on taking it on long cruises. anyone who argues this is either too cheap and/or doesn’t know what they’re doing.
These shot glass sized pistons going 10,000 plus rpms only being cooled by the temperature outside the engine get hot as you could imagine.
“Oh but i’ve never had to use a temp gauge”
Idk what to say to these people^ either your timing is too retarded, jetting too rich, or you don’t ride up big hills. In traffic too it’s peace of mind knowing you aren’t gonna skid into the front end of the lifted truck behind you because you seized after going WOT uphill for miles.
At the end of the day 40$ worth of insurance for a temp gauge outweighs a 400+ dollar engine. In Mass, mopeds don’t need insurance anyways, so this is an even better investment. (edited)
In my opinion you are already siezed by the time your cht gauge tells you. If you want real time you need egt. Cht is good for tuning but I wouldn't live by it.
> Satan 666 Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> In my opinion you are already siezed by the time your cht gauge tells
> you. If you want real time you need egt. Cht is good for tuning but I
> wouldn't live by it.
Or just not push it close to 400. If I really have to i’ll pull over when it hits 385 on the temp gauge (i’ve had 5 of them total now on diff bikes etc. never had an issue seizing or them breaking on me) Don’t think I need real time updating for my own purposes, especially if I just don’t go to 400.
I’m in agreement that EGT is probably more accurate, but for ease of use/reliability the little Trailtech CHT has done me fine... Just like SHA clones do some people fine... me not so much haha
cheers everyone
So I did end up buying that kit I linked up above. a 44mm airsal kit with a 16.16 dellorto SHA
Do you guys think temperature is really going to be a concern here? I don't really plan on going on crazy long rides or anything. This is going to mostly serve for my 15 minute commute to work that includes one small hill.
I've never seized a moped on long rides, its always been those short rides...
temp gauges are great on long rides, then ya know if you're overheating while sitting at idle, or maybe on a long hill, or a long WOT blast.
they aren't great when you have a massive air-leak cause you'll seize before the spark-plug gets hot on the outside. (edited)
If you put a larger cylinder kit on the bike you need to retard the timing a couple of degrees. If you don’t adjust the timing from stock, you’ll probably seize pretty soon after installing the kit.
Here’s a link to a good tutorial on how to check and adjust timing of an E50 with points^ similar concept on all mopeds.
Before you install that airsal kit, make sure to chamfer/lightly grind the edges of all the cylinder ports, you don’t want a ring of the piston getting hung up on a port.
Also check your ring gap, more info on this in the wiki.
Jet it rich when you put on the new carb, go down by size until 4 stroking stops at top speed. Go easy the 1st like 100 miles (break in time is argued greatly) but on mopeds 100 miles of not gunning the throttle at top speed for extended periods of time tends to do a lot of good (in my experience)
> Mario Marin Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> So I did end up buying that kit I linked up above. a 44mm airsal kit
> with a 16.16 dellorto SHA
>
> Do you guys think temperature is really going to be a concern here? I
> don't really plan on going on crazy long rides or anything. This is
> going to mostly serve for my 15 minute commute to work that includes one
> small hill.
I used a voltimeter and caliper through the spark plug hole to adjust the timing when we did it stock. Wouldnt that method be acceptable once we do the larger cylinder?
Yeah I just watched that video and that seems like a really inaccurate way compared to what I did....idk I got pretty perfect timing with that voltimeter and caliper method.
Okay, that method should work, but you have to be real careful keeping those calipers steady, and slowly turning the crank. you can definitely use a multimeter.
If you knew how to do that, i’m surprised you didn’t know enough to adjust the timing with a kit lol
> Dan (high idle) Conway Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Okay, that method should work, but you have to be real careful keeping
> those calipers steady, and slowly turning the crank. you can definitely
> use a multimeter.
>
> If you knew how to do that, i’m surprised you didn’t know enough to
> adjust the timing with a kit lol
It makes sense to adjust the timing I just haven't really thought that far ahead yet because I only just ordered the kit yesterday. My dad taught me the multi-meter and caliper trick and I've basically been learning everything from him so just taking it step by step.
EGT has a faster reaction speed to changes, but no one in mopeds talks about EGT because no pipes come welded with a bung for it.
EGT's also common for race bikes, and mopeds really don't require that much care. The CHT is perfectly fine for monitoring changes in operating temps which are direct leads to failure.
> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> EGT has a faster reaction speed to changes, but no one in mopeds talks
> about EGT because no pipes come welded with a bung for it.
>
> EGT's also common for race bikes, and mopeds really don't require that
> much care. The CHT is perfectly fine for monitoring changes in operating
> temps which are direct leads to failure.
heh....bung
> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> EGT has a faster reaction speed to changes, but no one in mopeds talks
> about EGT because no pipes come welded with a bung for it.
>
> EGT's also common for race bikes, and mopeds really don't require that
> much care. The CHT is perfectly fine for monitoring changes in operating
> temps which are direct leads to failure.
bring back the bungs
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