how many volts at idle should i be seeing coming out of the regulator on an hpi outer rotor system
im seeing only 3 volts but this increases as i rev it up
the readout on my digital mutlimeter make it hard to see an average figure as they go all over the place.
this is the wiring diagram for my hpi regulator/rectifier
https://www.hpi.be/downloads/210V261_eng.pdf
ive been searching on this forum for hpi info and come across a lot of stuff way over my head with floating grounds and keeping ac and dc grounds seperate
which i wouldnt have a clue how to do
i dont have a yellow ring to earth but have a yellow that has the output for lights etc
and looking at that diagram i connect the yellow to the units yellow and pink together? ( in reality its white not pink)
and this is my hpi system
note no yellow ring ground wire
orange goes to ignition coil and black white is to kill switch
im thinking its best to use dc volts and its 3v dc i am getting at idle
do i need a battery to keep the voltage stable to the lights? or if i dont want a battery ive seen mention of a capacitor. do i have to buy anything specific?
small would be nice so as to hide and retain the bikes aged look (edited)
but 3 volts at idle is that normal?
wont any lights be dim?
im in uk and am sure the law says i need to be able to dip my headlight and dunnno if you can do this with leds
3v is not normal. should be 12-14.3v. obviously the poster has the stator wires wrong. he'll get it once he wakes up and he stops trying to float the stator. its simple, just follow the diagram. hint: a dc stator has 2 wires, you must both stator outputs to run dc. ac one wire is grounded.
as much as I know I still learn. always wanted to know why the r/r is wired the way it is. especially since I don't do it that way. did not know you could run the same r/r ac or dc. now I know how.
the cap replaces the battery and wires in the same as a battery. its just a lot cheaper, smaller and lighter.
Alan Jackson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> hi el pollo
> im fairly stupid when it comes to electronics and would be grateful if
> you can take the time to answer 3 questions please.
> when you say a 63v 22,000uf cap would that work with my hpi
> regulator/rectifier wired up to produce dc volts like in the diagram in
> my post instead of the battery shown?
> and can i buy any type, are there differences? and how do they wire up?
>
> hpi reckon my bulbs should be 35w front and 5w rear. no other electrics
> not even horn so i think a battery is overkill
>
> cheers
> alan
3 questions, 1: no you are not stupid. don't worry about the trolls as they are stupid. I want to answer in open forum so others can learn. 2:they work in different ways. a battery will run the electronics with the bike off. the cap only works when the bike is running. what they both do is make dc parts work not dc volts it shorts out ac. 3:
it will work beautifully . the markings on a cap is different than a battery. a battery has the + marked a cap has - marked on the case. its easy and obvious.
just bought one
at idle its only 3v but this rises to over 12V at mid revs
i remember dim lights on my old puch and my yam 350 back in the 70's at idle and only above 1700 rpm did the system produce any power on the yamaha - the idiot lights would brighten up slightly as you revved it.
i was hoping a new 21st century system would have got it sorted but i suppose magnets are still the same magnets they have been since time began.
im buying a couple of those caps
cheers
alan, fwiw, i found the output of the 60w HPI stator to be very weak at idle.
if you want to keep lights at full output you'll need a battery.
you do not need a battery at idle. you need to lower the current draw at idle. you complain you did a high tech conversion but not high tech results. change to leds to get that stupid slow idle lower the ldle and finish the job.
You can either bandaid a low voltage at idle by reducing draw, or you can properly bolster your at-idle voltage by running the battery.
OR, simply live with dimmer lights at idle.
> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> You can either bandaid a low voltage at idle by reducing draw, or you
> can properly bolster your at-idle voltage by running the battery.
>
> OR, simply live with dimmer lights at idle.
bullshit Dillon, you can repair by reducing draw or you can run a battery.
Dillon may know mopeds but he does not understand ee. he is a troll. like a lot of the ma, does not understand how electrical engineering works.
At idle the voltage won't be that much. 3v is about right. Even if you did a voltage test across a battery in car or motorcycle with a battery system, you will see a minimal increase in voltage at idle compared to not running. Increase the rpm and the voltage will increase.
> el pollo Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> bullshit Dillon, you can repair by reducing draw or you can run a
> battery.
So, it's bullshit because you just repeated the same suggestion I had? Except running LED's is not doing what he wants: increasing available voltage at idle.
the idle output issue with the mini rotor comes down to geometry. it's not a matter of reducing current draw.
the smaller flywheel means a smaller diameter (and by extension, circumference) magnet. that reduces the speed at which the magnetic field is swiping across the stator poles, which in turn reduces the induced EMF for a given RPM. (edited)
sounds about right
to be fair i can live with dim lights at idle
i only posted about the 3V because i was worried there was something wrong with my system or i'd wired it up wrong.
I will never ever ride it at night, its purely for MOT purposes.
thanks for everyones help and suggestions,
i have a tiny 12V motobatt on another moped i can try (once its charged back up again) and will try the cap. i will also look into led's and see whats good and whats bad
> Alan Jackson Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> I will never ever ride it at night, its purely for MOT purposes.
I said the same thing .
Then one rain drenched night , my wife called . Her Jeep quit , at a stop light .
Nothing but the FA50 would start , so , guess what ...
To the rescue I went . In the driving rain , on the trusty FA50 .
It never quit all the miles to her and back to camp , all the while in a deluge of sub tropical down pour .
Anyway , Never say Never . ;)
> Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > el pollo Wrote:
>
> > -------------------------------------------------------
>
> > bullshit Dillon, you can repair by reducing draw or you can run a
>
> > battery.
>
> So, it's bullshit because you just repeated the same suggestion I had?
> Except running LED's is not doing what he wants: increasing available
> voltage at idle.
your problem is that you have no idea about ee theory. running leds increases voltage at idle. it has to. it is also a repair for weak stators. you have no idea what you are saying, yet you still come up with retarded dumb ass ideas I will never repeat.,
honestly without led's you can run without the cap or the battery. in this case you are running dc with ac in it. will do no harm to regular bulbs. you only need pure dc to run leds. (edited)
> el pollo Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > Dirty30 Dillon Wrote:
>
> > -------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > el pollo Wrote:
>
> >
>
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
>
> >
>
> > > bullshit Dillon, you can repair by reducing draw or you can run a
>
> >
>
> > > battery.
>
> >
>
> > So, it's bullshit because you just repeated the same suggestion I had?
>
> > Except running LED's is not doing what he wants: increasing available
>
> > voltage at idle.
>
> your problem is that you have no idea about ee theory. running leds
> increases voltage at idle. it has to. it is also a repair for weak
> stators. you have no idea what you are saying, yet you still come up
> with retarded dumb ass ideas I will never repeat.,
Running LED's does not increase the voltage output of the stator at idle. The stator will only produce a set amount of power per RPM.
Replacing bulbs with cheap LED's doesn't mean you've fixed the problem of low idle voltage. It just means you've worked around it.
Your understanding is flawed.
> > your problem is that you have no idea about ee theory.
really having a hard time because you don't have a fucking clue. the posters 3v at idle is with the headlight connected. shut off the headlight then what will the idle voltage be?
> el pollo Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > > your problem is that you have no idea about ee theory.
>
> really having a hard time because you don't have a fucking clue. the
> posters 3v at idle is with the headlight connected. shut off the
> headlight then what will the idle voltage be?
You are assuming he was reading with the headlight attached. He stated clearly he was metering output at the r/r, which would indicate that he had already pull the headlight from the equation.
Maybe if your advanced degree provided you with adequate reading comprehension, you would have seen that.
no head or tail lamp connected when i tested with the multimeter
in fact i have yet to find a coarse -ish bulb that fits the bulb holder
i can always ditch it and get a holder to suit more readily available bulbs
> > your problem is that you have no idea about ee theory.
really having a hard time because you don't have a fucking clue.
went on the hpi website. that is a 60w stator. are you telling me a 60w stator at idle puts out 3v with no load. bullshit.
> el pollo Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > > your problem is that you have no idea about ee theory.
>
> really having a hard time because you don't have a fucking clue.
>
> went on the hpi website. that is a 60w stator. are you telling me a 60w
> stator at idle puts out 3v with no load. bullshit.
To quote the OP
"no head or tail lamp connected when i tested with the multimeter
in fact i have yet to find a coarse -ish bulb that fits the bulb holder
i can always ditch it and get a holder to suit more readily available bulbs"
So I mean yeah that's with no load. It's rated for 60w peak output, so at idle even with no load it's not gonna be putting out 60w. If you wire up a battery you'll have more even brightness across the rev range.
at this point, I honestly think he has mental issues.
nick, never said a 60w stator puts out 60w at idle. I say its total bullshit that a 60w stator puts out 3v at idle.
ken gilbert fuck you. going to grad school is not a mental condition. I have experience and education. please tell us what education you have. I have a 30w stator on a dirtbike that puts out 14v at idle. you don't know this?
just to prove ken and Dillon know nothing, what is the other way to wire dc. you see the diagram. how else could it be wired? no way these trolls have this ability. (edited)
> el pollo Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> I have experience and education.
Sadly, it's no experience with mopeds and an education in something other than engineering.
> el pollo Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> ken gilbert fuck you. going to grad school is not a mental condition.
every time you open your mouth, more bullshit spews from it. that's the mental condition.
every time you get backed into a corner, you deflect with ad hominem attacks and strawman arguments. that's the mental condition.
let's assume for a moment you're not a pathological liar. to be even accepted to grad school program you need a bachelor's degree. where's yours from? what's the degree in? what year did you graduate?
in another post you said "there is one thing dillon or anyone can't take away from me. its grad school. I finished." https://mopedarmy.com/forums/read.php?1,4334522,4339243#msg-4339243
so did you GO to grad school, or did you FINISH grad school? unsurprisingly, your stories keep changing. if you FINISHED grad school that means you have an advanced degree, like a masters or doctorate. you must be very proud, and would likely hang that kind of diploma on the wall, not to mention leverage it into a career since it's such a large investment of money and time.
the truth is you don't even have a high school diploma/GED.
> I have experience and education. please tell us what education you have.
since you asked, my bachelor's is from providence college ('96), with transfer credits from the us naval academy ('91-'94). for more information you can read about my professional accomplishments and employment history on my linkedin page: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kagilbert/
<< I say its total bullshit that a 60w stator puts out 3v at idle.
yup and thats why i posted my OP in case i'd wired something up wrong
does seem a bit low to me but if ken gilbert and john maxson say its about all i can expect at idle on a hpi mini rotor at least i know i havent done something wrong and can move on to worrying about something else
> el pollo Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> nick, never said a 60w stator puts out 60w at idle. I say its total
> bullshit that a 60w stator puts out 3v at idle.
>
> ken gilbert fuck you. going to grad school is not a mental condition. I
> have experience and education. please tell us what education you have. I
> have a 30w stator on a dirtbike that puts out 14v at idle. you don't
> know this?
>
> just to prove ken and Dillon know nothing, what is the other way to wire
> dc. you see the diagram. how else could it be wired? no way these trolls
> have this ability.
did you scrape off the paint on the frame at the ground point? 3v means the headlight will be off at idle. they wont start working till about 7v, and that's dim. anyway something is wrong because you have a 60w stator.
so how do I run 12v on a 6v bike. change regulator from 6 to 12v. change the sockets to fit modern bulbs. lower the load so you don't need a battery put a cap so the leds don't blow.
is there anyone who reads my threads after the trolls stomp them out? lets see. tell the trolls how else you can wire dc.
ken gilbert and Dillon don't know how else it could be wired. man their threads are all the same, nonsense, retarded. never factual. I went to state became a doctor. it did not cost that much. paid for the ee myself at a private university they offered me a 1/3 off tuition. turned them down because I got accepted to state grad. my bs undergrad is in chemistry. never broke bad, but I think about it often.
> el pollo Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> man their threads are all the same, nonsense, retarded. never factual.
This isn't my thread. The OP didn't ask for a walk through of how Dr. Chicken would wire up a moped he theoretically might own. He just was asking about specs and real numbers.
You don't know what an HPI puts out at idle because you don't have a moped or an HPI ignition. You want to criticize for factual information, yet you have 0 hands-on experience working on moped ignitions.