Flywheel magnet strength

Has anyone tried to replenished or strengthen magnet strength of their flywheels in order to up the output of the magneto ?

What steps were taken and to what end ?

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

Brad William /

Second google link for "how to replenish a magnet"

https://sciencing.com/increase-power-magnet-7617616.html

"Take the magnet which has lost its power and stroke it with the stronger magnet. Linear strokes in a single direction will realign the electrons within the magnet, which will help its strength to increase. Stroke the magnet for around 15 minutes, and check to see if the strength has returned."

…. that skillset ought to be pretty well established for some folks here:)) (edited)

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

I've read that before .

I was wondering if anyone here has had any kind of luck getting any method to work .

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

Get some magnet wire and rewind the coils:

the more even you ply up the magnet wire = the more you will wind on the iron core = the more electricity it has the potential to produce.

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

I've played with all sorts of Vespa magnetoes . The 12 v ones put out more energy and voltage than the 6 v ones and won't power up a 12 v kinetic coil. There is physics at work making these ignitions match. Somebody knew about magnetic strength when designing. When these permanent magnets weaken I think they make good door stops.

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

> Rebel Moby Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Get some magnet wire and rewind the coils:

>

> the more even you ply up the magnet wire = the more you will wind on the

> iron core = the more electricity it has the potential to produce.

I have rewound coils with good results .

But , if the magnets are weak , the coils will still not produce to their potential .

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

> Marc Friedman Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> When these permanent magnets weaken I think they make good door stops.

Seems such a waste of good material .

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

Magnets do not 'leak' or 'weaken over time', they need an outside influence to weaken them. Stored too hot (above 250 °C) or too cold (below -40 °C) will weaken a ferrite magnet quickly, getting near those temperatures will slowly weaken them slightly. Mechanical shock like striking with a hammer will quickly weaken a magnet, or storing a ferrite magnet near a stronger magnetic field can weaken or even could reverse the polarity.

Just wondering how you determined the magnets were weak and not the coils having internal shorts from insulation breakdown in the magnet wire.

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

> Rebel Moby Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Just wondering how you determined the magnets were weak and not the

> coils having internal shorts from insulation breakdown in the magnet

> wire.

Bulb , plug and wire / connection testing was my first step .

That all was copacetic .

Coil testing was my next 'step' .

I tried a couple different coils , on of which was new . All 3 coils produced pretty much the same . I rewound one of the lighting coils with what I consider excellent results , but still on the marginal side .

That left the magnets .

Using a bolt and my feel for pull , the simplest method , I compared magnets from different flywheels .

It was pretty obvious that the magnets in question were noticeably weaker .

I tried the stacking method of strengthening a weak magnet . I only have a round ferrite magnet that has a strong pull . I believe the weak magnets are stronger after the 'partnership' .

It seems to me that the weak magnets can be made much stronger , enabling a better/closer to optimal output from the system .

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

Excellent. if the original magnets are of poor quality the 're-energizing' would be short lived if the engine was not used on a daily driver though.

Just thinking if you selected a nut and hooked it onto a pull scale you could determine the strength of the magnet rather than feel. Feel could be influenced by preestablished opinion but the data points would proof the actual strength before and after 'partnership'.

> P D Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> > Rebel Moby Wrote:

>

> > -------------------------------------------------------

>

> > Just wondering how you determined the magnets were weak and not the

>

> > coils having internal shorts from insulation breakdown in the magnet

>

> > wire.

>

> Bulb , plug and wire / connection testing was my first step .

>

> That all was copacetic .

>

> Coil testing was my next 'step' .

>

> I tried a couple different coils , on of which was new . All 3 coils

> produced pretty much the same . I rewound one of the lighting coils with

> what I consider excellent results , but still on the marginal side .

>

> That left the magnets .

>

> Using a bolt and my feel for pull , the simplest method , I compared

> magnets from different flywheels .

>

> It was pretty obvious that the magnets in question were noticeably

> weaker .

>

> I tried the stacking method of strengthening a weak magnet . I only have

> a round ferrite magnet that has a strong pull . I believe the weak

> magnets are stronger after the 'partnership' .

>

> It seems to me that the weak magnets can be made much stronger ,

> enabling a better/closer to optimal output from the system .

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

> Rebel Moby Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Excellent. if the original magnets are of poor quality the

> 're-energizing' would be short lived if the engine was not used on a

> daily driver though.

>

That's a possibility .

As far as I know , from otherwise good sources , these magnets are Alnico . Like many things , there is no documentation from the factory to verify that claim .

I've read conflicting claims that Alnico magnets can and can not be recharged .

If they can not be , how is it that I could easily feel a difference after the partnership or parring with a stronger magnet ?

Considering the age and possible mistreatment of these flywheel magnets , I'd say they are of good quality .

I can see why the quality of magnet base material would possibly effect longevity and even magnetic strength, but , how being used daily or not has any effect , I'm drawing a blank .

And , 'preestablished opinion' ... I'm well aware of that flaw and try not to have it influence my judgement . Still , a meter would give a better , possibly unbiased , 'opinion' . ;)

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

Having the magnetic flux flow back and forth through the iron cores of the coils would help to keep the electrons aligned in the magnets, a magnet is only weak if there are electrons who do not fall in line. Recharging is just convincing the ones who are not inline to get in the right direction.

I would figure the quality of the magnets for our use would be gauged by the initial strength, their ability to recharge would be a consideration as well as how long they would retain the boost in strength.

This discussion is leading me to think that perhaps I should pull a bunch of Novi 120x magneto flywheels and do some measuring and figuring :)

> P D Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> That's a possibility .

>

> As far as I know , from otherwise good sources , these magnets are

> Alnico . Like many things , there is no documentation from the factory

> to verify that claim .

>

> I've read conflicting claims that Alnico magnets can and can not be

> recharged .

>

> If they can not be , how is it that I could easily feel a difference

> after the partnership or parring with a stronger magnet ?

>

> Considering the age and possible mistreatment of these flywheel magnets

> , I'd say they are of good quality .

>

> I can see why the quality of magnet base material would possibly effect

> longevity and even magnetic strength, but , how being used daily or not

> has any effect , I'm drawing a blank .

>

> And , 'preestablished opinion' ... I'm well aware of that flaw and try

> not to have it influence my judgement . Still , a meter would give a

> better , possibly unbiased , 'opinion' . ;)

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

Magnetism fascinates me, although my understanding of it is minuscule in relation to the laws and theory of magnetism. But in my mind, if I could figure out how, it seems as though a magnetic field could be produced, with very powerful, permanent rare earth magnets, to levitate and spin a generator armature, and if done in a vacuum, there would be no frictional or atmospheric resistance, and if the magnetic force of the magnets was greater than the generators resistance, then a power generating, perpetual motion device could be developed. But I'm not educated enough. Levitation is the easy part, and continuing rotation is then not hard, once started. But then what? A flywheel spinning a planetary gyroscopic unit, I suppose. But I didn’t finish engineering school.

Anyway, cool topic. I look forward to seeing what you guys come up with.

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

To clarify , any weak magnet should be able to be made stronger when parred temporarily to/with a stronger magnet in the correct manner . How long and at what level the effect will last would be limited by the 'quality' of the base material of the weak magnet .

I am debating which method to use , one or maybe both :

Attaching small neodymium ( N52 ) magnets to the corners ( North & South ) ,

Or , rubbing / stroking the weaker magnets with a single bigger / much stronger neodymium magnet .

The flywheel I'd experiment with will accommodate small magnets on the back outside corners of the installed permanent magnets . Obviously , the small magnets would have to have the proper north/south orientation to be any kind of effective .

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

Corners of the magnet?

I am thinking it would make sense to have them aligned with the magnet with the poles agreeing, perhaps epoxy glued to the flywheel...

I will have to gather some iron powder and check if this will work to increase the flux or no...

Magnetocoilflux.jpg

> P D Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> To clarify , any weak magnet should be able to be made stronger when

> parred temporarily to/with a stronger magnet in the correct manner . How

> long and at what level the effect will last would be limited by the

> 'quality' of the base material of the weak magnet .

>

> I am debating which method to use , one or maybe both :

>

> Attaching small neodymium ( N52 ) magnets to the corners ( North & South

> ) ,

>

> Or , rubbing / stroking the weaker magnets with a single bigger / much

> stronger neodymium magnet .

>

> The flywheel I'd experiment with will accommodate small magnets on the

> back outside corners of the installed permanent magnets . Obviously ,

> the small magnets would have to have the proper north/south orientation

> to be any kind of effective .

Re: Flywheel magnet strength

Makes you wonder why the japs have removable magnets on their flywheel.

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