Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Hey mopedarmy. I live in Denmark where most of our mopeds comes with a kickstarter instead of pedals. moped like puch maxi, kreidler, sachs, yamaha all comes with footrests and a kickstart. why is it that all the mopeds in usa i've seen on youtube have pedals? is it enforced by law or is it just that not many kickstarter models were imported?

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Back in the 70s, when most bikeswere being imported. The law required pedals...in the 1980s alot of states changed to allow bikes like the Honda express to be ridden as mopeds too...

Some states still require pedals, if not they would be registered as motorcycles. Which requires a different licence. (edited)

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

MO-PED...……...mo=motor,ped=pedals. Not TOO hard to understand that you Europeans are riding NO-PEDS.

It's okay, at least you weren't calling `snails' mopeds. LOL!

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Don't mind Don if he sounds like a dick, he doesn't understand the delicacies of translation and cultures outside of the eastern United States.

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Sure thing wasn't being a smartass, just curious. They aren't called mopeds in europe i just know the english term for them not the whole meaning behind the word.

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

> Nick Haber Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Don't mind Don if he sounds like a dick, he doesn't understand the

> delicacies of translation and cultures outside of the eastern United

> States.

So funny! I didn't insult the man...……….I just educated him. Anyone should appreciate that.

He is talking NO-PEDS...…..no pedals,get it Nick? Nah,you probably don't. LOL!

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

DumDum being dumdum. You should disregard everything he says.

I'm not a fan of pedals or kickstarts. I prefer push-starting my mopeds.

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

what are they called in Europe anyway?

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

> Chapel C Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> what are they called in Europe anyway?

That depends on which European country you are in. Over here its "Brommer" or the old timey "Bromfiets".

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Most states had a moped specific law which allowed low powered mopeds to operate with few legal requirements. Many states did not require a license, insurance or registration. They required the moped to have pedals, have an automatic transmission and could not go faster than 15-30mph (Speed varied by state). By the mid 1980's most states removed the requirement for pedals, but by then it was mostly Japanese scooters being sold.

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Manufacturers also pushed the "And you can pedal it like a bicycle!" aspect of it, due to the 70's gas crisis here.

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

> Saabsonettguy . Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Most states had a moped specific law which allowed low powered mopeds to

> operate with few legal requirements. Many states did not require a

> license, insurance or registration. They required the moped to have

> pedals, have an automatic transmission and could not go faster than

> 15-30mph (Speed varied by state). By the mid 1980's most states removed

> the requirement for pedals, but by then it was mostly Japanese scooters

> being sold.

The automatic transmission part of the law amuses me since all other things being equal a variated set up will usually be much quicker than a manual transmission, but I guess they were looking at 37 speed 100mph 50cc gp bike specs when they made the laws?

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Probably Fred /

I want to say sears coined the word moped in the 60s with this really cool fast two speed hand manual shift bike just like the one a old man on my street let me ride/learn on when I was in 7th grade and got me hooked

F1DDB0AC-D741-4391-BD90-3D5BED66A150.jpeg

And that’s what a moped is, a bike with petals,

Nothing else really is a moped unless it can be pedaled,

But Then all 50cc bikes got the generic name moped and even plastic snail lookin scooters of any cc became Mopeds too. Just like the pain reliever aspirin which aspirin was a brand-name not the name of the actual medicine but people just kept calling it aspirin.

Now I don’t even call my my bikes Mopeds any more because people think I have a scooter/scooters, I now I have to call all my bikes “motorbikes” to people because there’s no way they look like a plastic scooter!

8B3FCF85-9E91-4AF5-873F-483419CF53B8.jpeg
ABDEFBD4-623B-46F0-8604-C728A83FE280.jpeg

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

I'm a little different, Ken, in that I ALWAYS call attention to the pedals first. Yeah, it's a 50cc motorbike, but it's a true moped according to the definition.

Doesn't matter that it's 64cc or 70cc or 100cc, the Authorities' definition is not the true definition.

Motor, even 4-stroke or electric, plus pedals makes it a moped.

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

I've got 2 we are working on now, both from dos. I'll tryn return with pics, a benelli g2 and malaguti dribbling with kickstart M1. Both run, Neither run right. G2 has a very illusive intermittent spark issue, the M1 was very restrictive stock and the kit's transfers overlap the area on the case. Or at least very close. I'm hoping to reinforce w JB and build up a thick compressible felt gasket. Both very cool, but alotta my bikes you dont get the quarter kick perfect tune and I just make up for it by running or pedaling for a little minute until it starts to pick up. Kicker you're just kick kick kick kick kick

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Fiftyracer . /

here in the uk the pedals were required by law until 1977 in order for the bike to be classed as a "moped" under law and be ridden by 16 year olds.

I own later pedal start maxis than this as they were still produced after that of course.

since 1977 the law just says 50cc/30mph is a "moped" class bike and 16 yr olds can ride it (edited)

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Here in Finland mopeds had mandatory pedals until 1970 when law changed. Government realized nobody wants to pedal 50-60kg mopeds anywhere. From that day onwards almost all moped models made or imported were kickstarts. There was one model which endured until 1987 and that was Tunturi Maxi. Variations of this moped (nicknamed Pappatunturi as it was popular with older men) was made in several configurations (pedals+2spd automatic, pedals+2spd hand shift, kickstart+2spd footshift and for a brief moment also pedals+3spd hand shift) until 1987. They all came with Puch motors and were named Maxi (pedals), Automatic (surprice with automatic gearbox) and Start (kickstart model).

Finnish word for moped is Mopo (short for moottoripolkupyörä ie. motorized bicycle). The name stuck even though pedals vanished into history and even today all 50cc and smaller mopeds are called mopo even in legislation so here they are officially mopeds. BTW. also "mopedi" is a correct Finnish word for moped, maybe a bit more official sounding one - something old people might use.

Here is a pic gallery of "Pappatunturi" -mopeds.

Other popular makes in Finland were Solifer, Helkama and Honda (Monkey), Suzuki (PV). Tunturi also made top tank sport models like Sport, Supersport and Trial.

I have no idea what mopeds/mopos modern youth buy today. (edited)

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

About Sears making up the term moped in 60's: I just noticed that in Tunturi-ad from late 50's they were already called mopedi ie. moped. So the word was in general use here by then. They weren't the first mopeds sold here either. (edited)

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Benjamin The Wandering Pacer /

> Tony H. Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Here in Finland mopeds had mandatory pedals until 1970 when law changed.

> Government realized nobody wants to pedal 50-60kg mopeds anywhere. From

> that day onwards almost all moped models made or imported were

> kickstarts. There was one model which endured until 1987 and that was

> Tunturi Maxi. Variations of this moped (nicknamed Pappatunturi as it was

> popular with older men) was made in several configurations (pedals+2spd

> automatic, pedals+2spd hand shift, kickstart+2spd footshift and for a

> brief moment also pedals+3spd hand shift) until 1987. They all came with

> Puch motors and were named Maxi (pedals), Automatic (surprice with

> automatic gearbox) and Start (kickstart model).

>

> Finnish word for moped is Mopo (short for moottoripolkupyörä ie.

> motorized bicycle). The name stuck even though pedals vanished into

> history and even today all 50cc and smaller mopeds are called mopo even

> in legislation so here they are officially mopeds. BTW. also "mopedi" is

> a correct Finnish word for moped, maybe a bit more official sounding one

> - something old people might use.

>

> Here is a pic gallery of "Pappatunturi" -mopeds.

>

> Other popular makes in Finland were Solifer, Helkama and Honda (Monkey),

> Suzuki (PV). Tunturi also made top tank sport models like Sport,

> Supersport and Trial.

>

> I have no idea what mopeds/mopos modern youth buy today.

Hey, Do you know if you could find me a copy of the Tunturi City manual that came with the Morini M101K? I have been looking for one for a while. :D

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Sears with their 'Mo-Ped' obviously had the biggest marketing impact, nearly everyone in the country had a sears catalog next to the toilet and the pages with bras, guns and motorcycles were probably about the most worn out.

Germans call them 'Mofa' although a german guy i used to work with had a different word that they used as slang as well, i'm not sure what that translates to as they use 'Rad' for bicycle type stuff.

Either way pretty cool thread discussing mopeds in different languages... always blows my mind that we walk around calling a whole country 'Germany' when its 'Deutschland' to the people living there... like if you live in minnesota my name would be Steve but in Wisconsin i'm graham? Crazy!

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

In denmark they are called a "knallert" "knall" meaning a loud noise and -rt is a plural. so the word mean "many loud noises"

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

> Tony H. Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Here in Finland mopeds had mandatory pedals until 1970 when law changed.

>

Does Finland still have "moped" cars?

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Chöschi21 C.K. /

Do you know what he said in German? Maybe i could translate it.

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

> Benjamin The Wandering Pacer Wrote:

>

> Hey, Do you know if you could find me a copy of the Tunturi City manual

> that came with the Morini M101K? I have been looking for one for a while. :D

Sorry, could not find a PDF for the Morini version, only to Puch version.

Here is a Tunturi spare parts catalogue for moped made in 1960-1994. Pages 114-125 apply to City Morini, I think.

Here is a paper copy of the Morini tech manual. According to description it includes electric diagram, blow up pics for motor, front end & brake handle.

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

> Thomas TPRF Wrote:

> Does Finland still have "moped" cars?

Ah, the abomination ;) Sadly yes. They are very lightweight 2 seater "car" which teens can drive if they have the moped license. The "mopo-auto" is actually a nickname, the official term is kevyt nelipyörä" (ligh 4-wheel). Age limit 15 like mopeds. The cars can have max 50cc gas engine or unlimited size diesel or electric engine with max 4KW of power. Max weight 350kg (~700lbs). Max speed limit is 45kmh (28mph).

I believe they will be gone in some years. They have proven to be very unsafe. No proper safety gear or structures other than safety belt. Plastic boxes, which disintegrate on impact. Too big and slow, cars have to realize they are infact moped-cars and avoid. They can be driven on highways with speed limits upto 100kmh (60mph) so there is dangerous situations every day. And there has been bad, even lethal, accidents. Normal mopeds are much easier to pass so they are surprisingly safer. After moped cars were introduced teen traffic accidents and fatalities have risen.

Also, moped cars are super expensive. New ones can be 20000€+ (USD22000+), their quality is bad and spares are expensive too. This year a new law was passed which allows later this year teens to buy real cars, install a speed limiter and drive those. The speed limit will be 60kmh (37.5mph) which is still slow but better. In town areas official speed limits for all vehichles are usually 40-50kmh so more than adequate for that. And modern cars have airbags, ABS, crumble zones etc. And much cheaper second hand + spares availability much better.

I don't expect moped-cars to survive this. After some years the old ones in great numbers will be gone too. Which is great. (edited)

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Lets discuss Tunturi City quickly. I guess that is something also Americans can identify? Its pretty much the same concept as Puch Maxi. Puch E50/E50S -motor, 1 speed, centrifugal clutch etc. Was made in 1979-1985.

Later model with Morini K101 was made 1988-1998. These have variator too.

I don't think I have ever seen one in person though. But, I guess thousands were sold back then. I only see them in sales ads.

In this gallery there are City -pics. Please note the Tunturi Mikro at top of the page ;)

Here is a gallery to even older Finnish mopeds from 50's to 60's. (edited)

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Okey, what about legal stuff? How is performance tuning, speeds etc. looked at in your country?

I suspect many EU countries might have strict limits on what you can do to your mopeds? I remember seeing some dutch(?) videos where cops even carry portable dynos to measure moped hp or speeds.

In Finland luckily not that bad. Well, ok - all performance motor tuning is forbidden but cops don't have dynos and they don't usually get interested in ones bike unless there is something obvious going on. And they most often target teens and very rarely older guys like me.

When cops do inspect a moped they first do a visual and then they actually drive it and see how fast it goes. Speed limit is 45kmh (28mph). If ones moped goes about 63kmh (39mph) or faster and you get cought then you are in "real trouble". That is the limit when they rule its an illegal motorcycle, take your reg plate, give you a fine and a mc tax to pay. Then you need to return the moped to original motor config and get it reinspected and registered. All this can cost several hundreds, even a thousand euros or more.

And if you are a teen then you might also lose your moped license because you were just riding a motorcycle without a mc-license. Additional fine for that too. So, teens need to remake a written test and pay for the moped-license again. Older guys have no moped-license to loose (people born before 1985 do not need one) and they don't get additional fine for driving the mc without license as they automatically have it if they have the car drivers license. But, if you are a hippie and don't have the drivers license then its another matter. ;)

Parts are easily available and performance tuning is popular though. Just need to stay under the radar on the mods. I guess super loud gold color tailpipe is the easiest way to signal to cops that you are up to no good. :D Sleeper is the name of the game here.

BTW: 1995 was the first year mopeds were registered in Finland. Before that only insurance was mandatory. (edited)

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Visiting as a kid I remember seeing lots of monkey bike type stuff on the road, even now it seems the street legal dirtbikes are more popular in Finland than my area of the US at least

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

Yeah, kids seem to mostly drive this kind of registered 50cc "mopeds" today (and 50cc scooters):

Not sure but I suspect they are made on same frames as 125cc bikes. At least they are pretty much the same size as my 1984 125cc Honda MTX enduro.

These things are quite cool when compared to bikes which were available 30-40 years ago. This is what I was running in 1979 or so (must be 20-40kgs lighter than mopeds of today):

(edited)

Re: Mopeds in USA vs Europe. where is your kickstart?

The last image failed and cannot edit it anymore. So here its again:

(edited)

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