Electric garelli conversion

Did something I myself have provably been an open opponent of myself, but curiosity... started with some discussions with mike boyd, what about a bolt on fully reversible electric conversion for mopeds?

A few weeks ago my friend Mark left his parts bike Garelli at my house. Totalled motor, no back wheel, no seat or lights, blown shocks, and we'd just swapped the forks to his other bike. I managed to smash this together for only about 400 bucks in just the past week. Despite only being able to work on it after kids asleep certain evenings when not hanging with my wife instaed, feeling pretty proud...

Had to do a ton of work making the forks work, swapping shocks, making seat mounts for another seat, replacing rusted out hardware, wiring in new lights, wiring up the electric, making a bolt in mount for the controllers and battery, adapting the electric wheel to fit, cleaning up the existing wheel to work and brake again, still needs longer kickstand. But it works!

36v 1000w hub motor in a 20" wheel size, with 16" moped tires. 10Ah battery. Pretty underpowered but kept it cheap just to figure out how to make it work. Goes low 20s. Balls slow up hills. But its ALL ENTIRELY REVERSIBLE. Controller and battery etc all bolts into the existing motor mounts. Uses 36 to 12v step down for lights.

Motor and controller kit on deal for $140

Step down converter $12

36V 10Ah battery $240

Metal box $12

Random metal welded together for motor to controller mounts and washers spacers etc, maybe another $20.

I plan to ride it til I can rebuild the stock motor and maybe sell the whole setup to someone who wants a slow electric garelli lol.

I'll post more photos and details later. Molly's trying to play farm, dont wanna miss out! so I gtg

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Re: Electric garelli conversion

This is cool!

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

1st made a metal block that bolts into the motor mounts.

I actually made this so the remaining parts bolt onto it, so it can be used to fit/make other motor mounts for whatever else the future holds, bigger setups or actual engines, whatever.

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Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

Then the wheel is a double flat to keep the axle from spinning while its driving. Was too narrow for the moped mounts so I quick made washer tabs to fit it snugly. More powerful motors also include little sort of lever extenders to keep it even more rigid, but this was easy and works. Basically that and spacing is all that's needed to fit the rear wheel. I think it's a 145mm axle length. It's actually a front drive motor but no difference really if no pedals are hooked up.

I'll post more tomorrow

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Re: Electric garelli conversion

Emil Kniemel /

This is really cool. Someone should do it for mopeds like Shanghai Customs does for cubs:

https://www.instagram.com/shanghaicustoms/

Monday Motorbikes already uses a Puch frame doesn't it? hmmm...

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

It was partway inspired by the Shanghai ones. I dont like the idea of a full "custom" kit in a box though, the shanghai ones do everything, seat, lights wider swingarm bars etc etc, doesnt leave room to pick your own adventure. I wanted just a bolt in motor setup that's as easy to remove as to add.

I will say I hadn't realized the shanghai customs were only 1000w, that's pretty slow, barely over 1hp. This is 1000w and struggles to get much past 20

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Most hub motors are crap especially those eBay kits most say 1000w but that's peak for a few seconds and 500w-600w continuous

Which controller did it come with does it have an unknown plug with 3 wires that doesn't go anywhere usually 1 black 2 grey snip it off the black and one of the grey wires together will make it faster

Re: Electric garelli conversion

> Born to be WillD Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> Then the wheel is a double flat to keep the axle from spinning while its

> driving. Was too narrow for the moped mounts so I quick made washer tabs

> to fit it snugly. More powerful motors also include little sort of lever

> extenders to keep it even more rigid, but this was easy and works.

> Basically that and spacing is all that's needed to fit the rear wheel. I

> think it's a 145mm axle length. It's actually a front drive motor but no

> difference really if no pedals are hooked up.

>

> I'll post more tomorrow

This is great, nice work Will.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

Heres the box and the bolt in mount I made. The box is bolted to the mounts so in principle you could reuse it to mount whatever motor or whatever

The box was a simple metal box off amazon, sized that would fit, it swings open to attach detach add wires etc or whatever.

I also made a reinforced square section to makes the box more rigid and gives a more solid mount for the battery underneath

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Re: Electric garelli conversion

If you are going to go full electric why not do it properly have the front and rear wheels hub motorised for 2wd and also have a crank mounted motor for extra pedal assist, nothing stopping it from being reversible.

Or just leave the moped engine in the frame for long distance riding (battery range generally sucks on an e bike)

you could use the mid drive motor signal to trigger the hub motors so that they only get power whilst pedalling. (edited)

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Or better still have the mid drive as the main motor capable of throttle cruising without pedalling so you can buzz along rear wheel drive only on minimal battery and have the hub motors as pedal assist, that way you when you pedal it kicks in all three and 2wd.

If the mid drive battery goes flat you can still pedal to get the hub motors turning, just make sure the hub motors are capable of free wheeling or have as little drag/parasitic load as possible so as not to affect the mid drive motors performance.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

This is the future. So stoked

Re: Electric garelli conversion

nice! I literally just sold a fully built magnum to a guy who is almost done making it fully electric!

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Probably Fred /

You are the man Will!

You’re giving me an idea like to install a front wheel electric hub on one of my magnums to make a 2 wheel drive moped!

We got to ride sometime together preferably in my kinda rural neighborhood like on some January thaw day when it’s like in the 60s,

Right now I’m doing very little riding because my development is completely torn apart due to sewer and road replacement!

it’s completely like off road riding basically!

For most of the summer Its a been a temporary gravel/dirt/mud road that was made on people’s tree lawns (After they moved the mailbox and fire hydrants like 15-20 feet back while they tear up the actual road) with drop offs in real deep mud and gravel that can’t support motorcycles and mopeds

I did the least amount of riding this past summer that I did my entire life!

A few weeks ago I downed my bike going only 15 miles mph, My front tire sank 6 inches into gravel that was put over a mud puddle!

I didn’t get much damage just a scrape on my elbow and a little bent pedal but still what the hell!

A 2 Wheel Drive moped may have worked pretty good to pull through these wet stones !

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The picture don’t show justice/it’s way worse when you hit patches like this especially after the water truck sprays it or even hrs after a rain!

Why make a road that motorbikes can’t ride on,

My neighbor has a custom Harley he hand built and had had to take a shop for some work he couldn’t do in his garage, on riding it to a shop to do the specialize work he need done.

He almost lost it twice when hitting those quicksand puddles of stone plus the gravel damaged his custom wheels and had to get a flat bedded back home !

I’d like to build a higher speed version of a rokon 2 wheel bike by putting at least a 1200 W electric motor on front wheel

Re: Electric garelli conversion

I think there should be a section on this forum dedicated to electric mopeds. I see more and more threads about electric mopeds and people willing to convert their vintage moped to electric. It would be nice to have a place to discuss and trade ideas.

I know there are e-bike forums out there but they all are dedicated to regular e-bikes or converting bicycles to e-bikes. None share the same mentality and interest towards vintage mopeds.

As Mike Boyd said, this is the future.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

wow this is awesome, i think eventually the ebike/mtb full suspension hybrid things will just merge and make dumb 150 lb mopeds irrelevant but i love the concept.

if you could post ebay or whatever links to what you bought that would be rad, its kinda dizzying the number of 'generic ebike kit' parts are out there, tough to tell what all works together.

i've actualy ridden a rokon, its totally rad but the front wheel drive makes it steer kinda weird, i dunno if you would want it for road use, but a high-geared moped with hybrid acceleration assist would be very rad.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Probably Fred /

> Guillaume Guite Wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------

> I think there should be a section on this forum dedicated to electric

> mopeds. I see more and more threads about electric mopeds and people

> willing to convert their vintage moped to electric. It would be nice to

> have a place to discuss and trade ideas.

>

> I know there are e-bike forums out there but they all are dedicated to

> regular e-bikes or converting bicycles to e-bikes. None share the same

> mentality and interest towards vintage mopeds.

>

> As Mike Boyd said, this is the future.

Yeah what good luck with that/making more forums!

When they redid this website a year or so ago they ruined it by not being able to see a page of close to 100 threads/posts at a time on one page.

Back in the day you could bump up anything very quickly especially on the buy sell forum because it went back 100 threads posts that were shown on one page,

You need to see your post/thread on the first page for a few days if not longer!

If you want to sell something it needs to be bumped up almost in a few hours so don’t get buried and disappear! Not that it will be gone nowadays days because the the views people on moped army are nothing like it used to be!

You can only see maybe 8-9 threads at a time with this new eye hurting white page irritating site!

You have to go back 3-4 pages instead of only opening up one page like the buy+ sell forum that went back a few days with a hundred threads, posts at a time that you saw the moment you opened it up,

No one wants to go click eight pages back to bump up their posts do to short attention span nowadays !

The old way the website set up was 1000 times better if you’re going to sell something or keep a thread going on !

It’s Basically a mobile version on a desk top and is a time waster!

Because you only can see a could only see Like 10 threads at a time!

The Amount of people posting in threads dropped like a rock since the new way was created!

I haven’t posted anything for sale since they changed the design of this site!

The old way was perfect I have no idea why it was changed?

This site used to be timeless! until it was changed to only see a 10th of the threads at a time without going back page after page,

but ya pages and threads are big and bold though!

Ya and There’s a few nutcase trolls here that should have their accounts be deleted years ago that attack old-timers who were moped owners throughout the whole moped generation who give very good advice when they give nothing but trolling!

Ya nothing in life is fair and no good deed goes unpunished I guess!

It’s nothing like it used to be but it’s better than a poke in the eye !

It sucks how things change and no one wants to perpetuate the vintage moped hobby,

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

Welp, in the truck it goes...

BUT! not because it died, it was running as mediocrely as ever, I actually had to go pick up he samurai from my wifes work so I threw it in the back. Didn't leak ANY gas nor oil!!!

I took the seat off cuz it's not a great mount and didn't want it popping off down the road...

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Re: Electric garelli conversion

Ive got a 78 the same color that needs a motor.

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Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

Hey if you want this electric setup or the original motor let me know. I'm not attached to either. The OG motor the crank's locked up and it has no topend, but the ignition and clutch parts are the cleanest I've ever ever seen on a moped, like they look completely brand new. kindof insane for how fuuuucked the topend was.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

I think your ebike is a goner, just send it all to me. I like the tail light on it.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

hah, taillight was whatever was easiest. I had that LED light and was worried it'd burn out on a moped AC setup, but works perfectly if the whole bike's battery powered.

I've been mostly riding this to work favoring it to other bikes, and done some math to support it.

#1, I'm averaging about 14mph (that's avg moving speed, including accel & decal so alotta stop & go) and peak speeds of 22. Range like usable range is about 8 miles. It'll go another 5 but gets really slow towards the end before the battery management cuts out to prevent over-drain. takes me about 20-25 min to get to work, about the same as riding a bicycle.

I've got a 10mi commute, but the return trip's mostly slight downhill so it can make it, just suffers the major slowdown on the return trip.

On the safari I'm peak speeds only like 28, average 18-19 and saves me a few minutes. By car I can get in in like 15 minutes...

Even at 75ish mpg on the safari and 2.60/gal gas, I'm at roughly $0.35 a day commuting. If I drive it's more like $1.20 because even with a pretty efficient car I'm only low 2s in city, and it's a slightly longer commute cuz I can't take advantage of a few moped-only cut throughs.

The garelli on the other hand takes maaaybe 5 cents.

So, if I commuted every day, this slowmo beaster would pay itself off (excluding time) in just over a year, or like 300 commutes. (2800 miles)

If the battery lasts through 300 charge cycles...

If I went for a big badass 2kW+ setup and a monster battery, it's easily gonna be $1200+, that'd take 3 years to pay off and I highly doubt you'd pull 1000 cycles off even the good batteries.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

The big cost is batteries, I've been disassembling NOS laptop batteries, most are built with the exact same 18650 cells. Used ones are already cycled out but usually it's one weakest link and there are a few still good cells in there too. Still, I'm sticking to new unused overstock. Good cells run like $5 a piece, but I'm pulling em outta batteries at about 1/4 that. Similar cost to cheap Chinese cells but they're not cheap.

It's insane I see the Chinese 18650 cells listed at like 5000, even 9000mAh, (vs 2200-2500 for quality Samsung/Panasonic) which is 100% impossible, you CANNOT get that kind of power into that size cell with any available materials, it can't be done, the chemistry is impossible - they just outright lie their faces off with the ratings. and when you test em they're actually like 1000mAh, less than half the good ones despite being "rated" 3-4x higher

I made a little spot welder out of a disposable camera. it's enough to stick the connecting strips to the battery cells, but probably not very permanently. So far I made a 24 cell pack that'll run 12V, it's about the size of a 1l soda bottle - so far just using it for testing lights and stuff on other bikes hehe, I need more cells and a decent spot welder to build anything I'd trust on a bike.

Still it's a fun project. I'll keep collecting cells if I get good deals and eventually buy a spot welder. maybe upgrade the controller and try'n run this at 48V

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Re: Electric garelli conversion

nice!

i was going down this path for a battery on my DT250 so i could run a huge light and in the end just decided it wasn't worth it.

the china cell thing is crazy crap, its a bummer they don't say exactly what they are so you can actually find out. its crazy that this whole market is based on people vaping and building custom vaporizers, who knew that had such a big market?

post up how you setup your charge controller, in the end that is what killed it for me, i want something that can handle constant charging/discharging and there just aren't any ready made (i.e. easy for dumb ME's like me) circuits i could find that were suited to automotive battery style draws. It would be rad to put a couple super caps together with a smart controller that can constantly shuffle charge from the caps and back to the battery so a high drain headlight and a moped charging system that puts out like 100W at full blast but <10W at idle, could play nice together.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

I'm not there yet, I just charge it off the wall, it's 3x3 cells so 3.7*3 = 11.1V and ~2000mAh cells. I was going to string em together to 36V.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

You need to look in to ebike builders. You gotta consider the amp hour of the battery, it's a factor in how fast and how far you can go. I got some notes somewhere from working out an awd ebike build. I had planned for a top speed of about 40mph, and a range of 20miles(to be on the safe side). I figured a battery with 72cells.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

Quite familiar with battery capacity ratings, I just mean when you buy cells even from like amazon but especially ebay or worst Alibaba, they lie their faces off. A battery will claim "OVER NINE THOUUUUUUSAAANNNDDDD" mAh per cell, which is strictly impossible, meanwhile struggle to manage even 500mah in reality

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Matthew Chua /

I'm trying to do a similar conversion to a ct90. do you have a link to the hub motor you used? i've just been looking at the ones on aliexpress and don't know if any are better than the others.

Re: Electric garelli conversion

Born to be WillD /

oh man, I don't but you can find dozens if you search 1kw 20" hub motor. theyre all the same, and all pretty garbage, and also realistically run 500w, 750W peak. Like it's a 36v setup and the fuse is maxxed at 25a which isnt even 1kw, and that's burning the fuse max output...

Personally I'd recommend getting on endless sphere or the endless sphere facebook and asking there. If I were gonna do it again I have a few build ideas in my head but easiest would be off em3ev.com, have them lace a mac motor 52V into a 20" rim (same size as a 16" moped/motorcycle wheel) or lace yourself into a 17 rim to stay true to stock cub.

or juiced has good battery options, luna might be good though i heard some bad reviews too. Better to buy from a name brans that has a reputation vs random stuff on amazon ebay and alibaba.

basically everything on alibaba is extremely full of shit. expect 10-25% of the advertised performance.

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