Group hug time (4 u all)

Now that i have all the atention...i must say than americans and canadians are so lame......why doesent you guys understand that europe an scandinavia are lightyears ahed i the moped area.

i dont care that a offroad bike (like mine Yamaha dtr) is classified as a dirtbike, motorcyckle or whatewer...this only aplies to america.

(if some american official would classified a volvo car as a airplane, you guys would probaly think so to and would never ever change your minds about it..even i a volvo run you over i the street)

Those mopeds i been trying to make you all ahware off are made in spain, italy, korea, japan..yadda yadda...are all designed to be mopeds..never has (eg, Reiju Drac) been even thought to be an motorcycle...thats your missunderstanding an crap american laws (canada to) doing...

my Yamaha DTR 2,5hp, 4gear, offroad, 60km/h, 95kg...has and always will be a moped....i dont actully care what anyone of you guys think..and for the 4wheel moped..ist real..is here in sweden...and once the laws i amerika changes and mopeds starts to get imported from europe..u all will see that i an right and u wrong...but untill then....tsk tsk tsk...hahaha...why i even bother...

http://www.tws-motor.se/buggy45.html

www.reiumotor.com

www.race.cjb.net

feel free to visit this sites when all of you whant to see som reael mopeds....welcome to the new era of mopeding.......

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

hey buddy there's no need to practice ethnocentrism here. let's be friends. cultural diversity rocks.

with love

dave

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

Simon King /

I think we all need to stop and look at the situation - you too Jan. Mopeds are classified differently based on where you live. This is something that we all know and so each persons perception of a moped is different. -- We all agree that they are lower powered vehicles though, nobody is going to mistake a high speed motorcycle for a moped.

That being said, the majority of discussion on this board is about mopeds that are under 50cc originally from the factory. This isn't a North America only board, but alot of the discussion tends to go that way since alot of the readers and posters are from America.

The adivce and information from people outside of America is awesome, and makes this board MUCH more valuable than it would be otherwise -- but there is no reason to bicker and fight over moped standards.

Jan, if there is something you'd like to say about what you call a "moped", then say it. But if all you have to comment about it is that it's "better" then the American classification then I don't really want to hear it. I'm not looking for "better" - mopeds are clearly a technology that I embrace for other reasons than the speed.

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

Hey Jan, why don't you just stop being so annoying and accept the fact that moped laws are different all over the world, the people that ride those peds have no say in those mopedlaws. The bike I ride would be a minibike in America, it's a motorcycle in Japan and it's a moped in Holland. No matter what the law says, it's still the same thing.

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

Oh no! Like the stupid amerikan that I am I fell for the lets be friends title. Tell me Jan, would a Harley Davidson be a moped in Europe? It seems strange that most of our mopeds in the U.S. were imported from European countries, yet they are not true mopeds. Jan proves that there are stupid people all over the world.

Ben

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

I agree w/ Simon. And Dan. And Ivo. We all have different definitions of mopeds. And I'm not going to argue that one definition is better than another. Who know what a "true" moped is.

BTW, I have some friends in Sweden. They are some of the nicest people I've ever met. And they have never been so ethnocentric as to think that everything Swedish is better. And Jan should know that some of the "mopeds" he advertises may not be (legally) mopeds in other European countries either.

No one is going to classify a Volvo as an airplane ... although Saab does make military jets. ;-) But mopeds are interesting BECAUSE they are so difficult to classify. So it's very different from place to place.

Again, in Michigan (USA) a 50cc scooter is a legal moped. Actually, our registration cards have a scooter on them and not a moped at all. We know the distinction, however. I don't think Jan would consider a Honda Elite a "moped", would he? So we make our own subjective decisions and combine 50cc (the legal) w/ the need for pedals (the "technical").

Sorry that Jan is so upset by our forum. And yet he keeps posting .... why is that?

Hey...Miguel...

.....would you show us your pencils again?

........................................................ cause you have the best pencils!

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

mo

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

Jan, please give us a quantifiable, enumerated explaination of what you feel a moepd is, personally as well as legally.

In America, a moped basiclly is:

<50cc

no manual transmition

cannot exceed 30 mph (25 is some states).

(i would add pedals and a non-scooter look/design.)

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

Reeperette /

>>although Saab does make military jets.<<

Having ridden in a Saab..well, damned if I would ride in some jet made by those dweebs.

If Tomos made a car, tho - I would buy it the minute they rolled it off the assembly line, they've got awesome engineers.

Ree.

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

hey ree,

right on! saab sux ass adn tomos rules! i love there desighns and everthing else about there bikes. if they made a car that woulb be awsome.

-mike

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

It's sad that Jan is a bigot when it comes to moped. He keeps saying: "I don't care what you think" blah blah blah blah ... but then he keeps posting!! If you don't care what WE think, Jan, then what makes you think we care what YOU think. Or is direct logic too much for you? Perhaps elliptical arguments are better:

I define mopeds as such ... because what I have is a moped ... so things that look like what I call mopeds are mopeds [a truisim] ... subsequently, those who disagree w/ my definition are "crap"

That is an elliptical argument (as opposed to a pure "circular" one). Tsk tsk tsk. And you thought Americans are dumb. [Oh, and don't lump the Canadians in w/ us ... they might get offended!]

My moped is an Italian one. A 1977 Bianchi Snark. So ... an original moped. It has pedals, 50cc, no manual transmition, etc. I love her to pieces. But I don't make fun of people who ride something else. Even if it is NOT a moped!!

So Jan, what makes you think that your bike is a moped? Answer: Swedish laws say that they are. So ... you believe Swedish definitions of things are better than other countries? Or do you believe that non-Swedish definitions are all inacurate? So everyone is wrong because they aren't Swedish? Or is Sweden right because YOU were born there? That's an interesting question, eh? ... My conclusion: if you were born in Tanzania and mopeds were defined as monkeys w/ saddles, you'd STILL think all our definitions are "crap" simply because it's not the one you use.

When the correctness of a definition is entirely up to you. Sounds like the Tweedle Dum argument from "Alice in Wonderland" (using words as you like to mean whatever you want them to be). If this is so, then you don't have an epistemological position from which to launch an argument against others' definitions. The basic principle, once you accept it, is that if YOU can define a word as you wish, then others are free to do so.

To emphasize, even if you ASSUME that you are inherently more correct than others, it is based only on your self-assumption that your definitions are correct. You can then NOT assume that others can't make similar assumptions about themselves. But, since humans are social animals (we communicate w/ each other), linguistic discourse REQUIRES that we assume that definitions are socially based and built from cooperative discourse -- accepting that neither of us has any logical reason to hold onto the truth.

So ... some Americans aren't so dumb, eh Jan? We can see through your weak philosophical assumptions. I don't care how YOU define mopeds. And since I'm not in Sweden ... I don't care how they are defined in YOUR country. My moped is registered in USA. So those laws apply to me. What moped definitions have in common is the important thing.

And you, Jan, came into this forum already assuming that we didn't care about your mopeds. Sergi and other have come in w/ great information on new mopeds and designs from Europe and Asia. Thank you guys! And we have shared w/ them many things. But you, Jan, are just a small-minded little man who wants to assume that Americans are SOOO stupid. Sorry, some Americans may be stupid ... but so are some Swedes, apparently!

RE: Group hug time (4 u all)

amen my smart friend

-mike

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