TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

MasterEug /

Well since no one replied to my earlier post about my moped, not even to answer one question, I went and started experimenting myself. I drained the oil (mostly) from my gearbox and that helped the thing switch into 2nd... Now I tried replacing the oil with 10W40, but that again made my gear switching worse. What oil does the gearbox take? 10W30? If I drained the oil (mostly) does it lessen the life of my box? If I replace the oil with 10W30, will it switch into 2nd? Some crazy poster said before that you should take the right side of your gearbox off and file 2 diagonall lines into your clutch, I never got that far, thank god.

So eh, reply please.

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

use 10w30, is ues pretty standardly. i am not sure what will happen if you drain most of the fluid out. i know too much will take away performance. too little runs the risk of damaging something though. you didn't get any replies, becaues the forum has been broken for a few days. I had to fix it, because i simon was out of town. i would have fixed it earlier, but i din't realize it need help.

keep watching your original post, it might pick up now.

dan

moped army

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

Reeperette /

I will again try posting your answers.

I was running into some kind of error message when posting, so, lets try this again.

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A - Trouble upshifting is often caused by too much oil in the transmission (I used 10w30 in my bullet, and the Targa's no doubt the same, in that.)

There is, or should be, a large screw on the left side of the transmission exterior with a paper washer - this is used to check the level of fluid in the trans - check it, if it starts pouring out (not dripping) you may well have too much fluid in there.

Or you could just change it, with 10w30, and the correct amount - usually 300-500ml.

B - Change out the plug, to a Champion Platinum, old reference # J82C.

C - Clean the choke lever assembly with carb cleaner, it's usually located on the left side of the carb, if it's a DelLorto.

D - Liquid is bad, yeah, but almost as bad is 'venting' from an improper cylinder seal (why they use a metal-to-metal no-gasket seal of two pieces of different kinds of metal is beyond me...)

It should be fairly obvious if it is, simply clean the cylinder thoroughly and look for signs of venting.

E - Actually, having a full exhaust on there helps assist compression by something called 'back pressure' and ensures better running.

with the old exhausts, you could pull the baffle (the piece on the inside) for a little better performance at the cost of a slightly different exhaust note...but i thought it sounded neat, myself.

Better still, however, to go with the Bi-Turbo, it makes more difference and is more effective.

Note: On exhaust silencing - I did see someone take the baffle out of one of the old exhausts, drill 4 strings of 8 1/8" holes in it, pack it with fibreglass, and put it back in there.

It did not significantly degrade performance, and that bike was nearly silent in low 2nd gear.

F - The only decent and trustworthy sprocket mod would not help too much, and is of medium difficulty even for the experienced to install - but it is fairly inexpensive, so make your own call there.

G - Tomos bikes generally run well on anything, but using the highest grade gasoline would prevent hassle in the long run - try sunoco's ultra 94.

H - As I recall, the oil mix for that engine is 50:1, as long as the injector is functioning, I wouldn't bother pre-mixing, have tried other ratios with that engine and it generally doesn't help.

You might add a teaspoon of octane booster to the oil when you fill it, just don't add too much.

I - Doing a brake job on a 'ped is a bitch, for a novice...actually most used bikes you get, need one, a lot of the time that is the factor that convinces someone to sell them - the hassle of doing a full front&back brake drum replacement.

Most kids who buy them, keep using the adjustment screws till they don't work anymore, usually jamming them...then sell the bike.

So yes, replace the shoes, front and back, and plan on it taking all day long.

J - I've never had a speedo on a 'ped actually STAY working for any length of time, don't bother replacing it..not like you need it, really.

K - Tire PSI, i've always used 32, but anywhere between 28-35 has been done, for various reasons of weight, weather and performance.

HIGHLY reccomended are Cheng-Shin interrupt-tread tires - they stick to the road and work well on dry pavement or even the worst of weather.

(would that they made tires that good for cars!)

L - It's been done, but much easier is just bungee-wrapping a boombox to the cargo rack.

May you only meet the road with your wheels between you,

Ree.

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

MasterEug /

Ok, sorry for any inconvenience :-)

That helped alot.

Also, how does a clutch get damaged on an auto transmition?? Like if one presses the brakes to their fullest and then pumps up the throttle, that would be damaging right? or will it?

CD's Skip btw :( if you dont have any ESP, ESP helps a little.

10W40 will have to do since thats all I have at the time :) Well I hope the ped' holds out tommorow when I take it on a 45 mile round trip to a X-country meet!!!

Thanks for all the help!!

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

Reeperette /

Honestly, with the Tomos dual-wheel centrifugal clutch system ?

I didn't know there was any way you could damage it...it's fairly impossible.

The one on my old Bullet was square in the impact zone of a 70+Mph combined speed T-bone collision, and it worked just fine when I slapped it in a new transmission housing.

So was I, but that took a lot more work to fix...

But if you are interested in how it works, ask a mechanic to explain how a centrifugal clutch operates, it's fairly simple, and will explain also why there is unlikely to be a problem with it.

Ree

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

MasterEug /

ok, great then :)

thanks for all the help!

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

i used to use the best stuff available just cause i thought it would be the most beneficial/least harmless until i heard you shouldn't use such high octane gasoline because it contains detergents and such that will have a negative effect on the oil. so recently i've just been using regular 87 on my tomos bullet ttlx and i've had no problems at all.

my speedometer has been running fine it just needed to be greased up. the mechanism isn't all that technical so it is a little slow to measure decreasing speed though it just sticks a little.

i have a front speed sprocket installed from www.themopedjunkyard.com and it runs fine and wasn't all that hard to get on there. there is a difference in speed but it's nothing phenomenal.

dave

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

twowheelers /

You shouldn't use anything else than ATF (Automatic Transmission Fluid). Type A is desired, but Dextron III can also be used. Older Tomos clutches (A3 engine) as well as most older mopeds could take the 10W30, but never Tomos's (A5 engine) can't.

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

twowheelers /

In regards to "why they use a metal-to-metal no-gasket seal of two pieces of different kinds of metal is beyond me.."- This is a standard on newer Tomos A5 engines to enhance the thermal conductivity e.g. more efficently cool the whole thermal unit. You may know that older A3 engines have a head gasket. That head gasket is made of copper, which is a very bad heat conductor. Thus if the cylinder hadn't been warming-up exactly as the head did, there was a lot of warping between the head and the cylinder. And if you count with that the less-than perfect resting surface.. Without the gasket the heat can dissipate much more efficently from the cylinder to the head and vice versa thus allowing a more uniform warm-up of the parts. Of course here a perfect seal is a must.

You are right in your implication of sealing two different materials, however aluminium and iron cast have very similar temperature elasticity coefficients and can be correctly sealed with a proper surface finish. The almost-matching coefficients are also the only reason why aluminium pistons can be used in cast iron cylinders.

RE: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

If it ain't shifting into second smoothly its prolly cuz ya could use a new clutch peice...next time u take it out..look at the thing..there should b 3 cork looking pads on it..if their missing that's ur problem there isn't sufficant force against teh 2 peices to pull the ped along....if u don't wanna spend money..filing some lines across it to increase friction may work..but the new part is the sure fireway...my friend dave had the same problem and it cleared right up

Re: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

UMMM ur not supposed to put 10w30 in a damn moped, if u are draing the transmission fluid on the bottom of ur ped then that is ur transmission fluid and ur supposed to put type FA transmission gluid in it not 10w30 , and ur supposed to put 2 cycle oil in the tank under ur seat!!!!!!!

get it right,

Tim

Re: TOMOS TARGA Answers, if anyone is intrested...

Wayne Broderick /

I think you can do either, Tim. I've frequently heard of using oil or fluid.

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