who wants $20?

help! i am totally out of ideas here. i've been trying to get my 82 puch free spirit running for the past six weeks now, and i just can't figure out what is wrong with it. i did the tests in fred's guide, and i'm pretty sure it has spark and compression, and --after a new fuel line & petcock-- hopefully fuel. i got a new spark plug, cleaned out the carburetor, cleaned the points, adjusted the carb needle & float......but nothing works!!!! i can get it to start great, and it will run real strong and nice for just a little while, then it just totally bogs down and dies. i'm really frustrated. i feel like i've tried everything, and this is my first-ever moped so i don't have any "moped friends" to help me out. so i am offering $20 to anyone in kalamazoo who can come look at it and tell me what the problem is. seriously. cash. i'm desperate.

==chris

Re: who wants $20?

Could be flooding out,but I doubt it.Does it have spark when it dies?That would isolate it to fuel or crankcase seals.I've seen really badly carbonned exhausts do that.Have you checked the exhaust?

Re: who wants $20?

Miniengine /

Did you clean out the exhaust? I had an old moped that would run great for just a little while and then it would die. Come to find out that the exhaust was clogged just enough to create back pressure that would kill the engine. Try taking the tail pipe/baffle section of the exhaust off the Puch and see if it runs any different.

One other thing that had me scratching my head was that I had a kink in the fuel line once that wasn't really noticable. The moped would run about as long as it took to drain the float bowl and then quit. If you're using clear fuel line this can sometimes be the problem. It looked to me like the fuel was moving through the line and it was, but not at the speed needed to keep the carb. supplied. Your problem doesn't sound like this because you said your engine bogs and then dies, but it's another idea.

Brian

Re: who wants $20?

Now wait a minute Brian.I beat you by 6 minutes with that exhaust thing so I ain't gonna split the 20 bucks with ya.Unnerstand?

Re: who wants $20?

InfectedBootSector /

My Puch did this... I replaced the float in the carb and it did fine, but I don't think that is your problem... you have gas coming out of the carb?

:(

Miniengine /

But Don I need the $20 for typing lessions so I can give quicker responces.

Brian

Re: :(

Okay,You get the 20 if you keep posting that good Batavus info,`ya know? (:)

im still stumped

wow! thanks for all the responses. i appreciate the advice. i already cleaned out the exhaust pipe and the port is as clean as a whistle. as far as fuel thru the carb, i'm pretty sure that there is at least some flow-- the line is not kinked or anything, and it does start, so it may be that the flow is just restricted and not totally cut off. also, i have one of those clear inline filters and that seems to always have gas in it. so maybe something in the carb is restricting flow... but what could that be??? cmon, i know someone wants $20.

thanks!!

==chris

Re: im still stumped

My guess is the coil or the condensor because I've been told that is the symptoms of it. It's just a shot in the dark, however.

Re: im still stumped

ok ... i'm in kzoo. not sure when i can come look at it (and i'm no puch expert). but check the sparkplug again. just cause it's new doesn't mean much. look at it to see what color it is. maybe you're running too lean or rich? what ammount of oil did you pre-mix w/ the gas?

and how did you clean the muffler? and did you take it off the engine altogether. even if the muffler isn't clogged, the exhaust port on the cylinder might be. so check that.

also, are you running it w/ the choke on? or off? that's about all i can think of.

oh, wait ... did it run well before? or never? if it's never, then start from the top and go down. you'll have to check the jet sizes (maybe it's the wrong one?). maybe the timing is off?

Re: im still stumped

when i first got it, it didnt really run at all. then when i got it running, it did something close to the same thing it is doing now. it did run at one point for a couple of days. it ran very nicely, but then it started doing this weird thing when it got to top speed. it would kind of bog down a little and lose power, and then rev back up, just alternating back and forth for about a second or two each. it just kind of progressed to the point where it would just bog down and die.

when i cleaned out the muffler, i took it off and that's when i checked the exhaust port. the muffler was very dirty, so i scraped off big chunks of carbon gook with a butter knife and a wire brush, then i sprayed it with oven cleaner a few times over the course of a day and just let it sit for a while. it did a pretty good job of cleaning it out.... but maybe i should try the campfire thing??

also, when i check the spark plug, it is pretty black, but it is wet after it starts up, so i'm pretty sure it it getting some fuel. as far as running rich/lean, i've tried putting the idle screw and carb needle in every possible position and it didn't have any effect on the bogging down. maybe it is cursed?

keep the tips coming, guys. i really appreciate all the help!

==chris

ps* miguel, do you know anyone in kalamazoo (or anywhere) that IS a puch expert? would you or another kalamazooan actually be willing to come take a look at it?? thanks!

Re: who wants $20?

HI I THINK I CAN HELP WELL I'VE BEEN RIDEING OLDER PUCHS FOR ABOUT 3 YRS NOW AND I WOULD HAVE TO SAY IF IT HAS BEEN SITTING AROUND FR AWILE THE JUNK IN THE GAS TANK PROBABLLY KEEPS CLOGGING THE JET SO TO FIX THIS THERES THIS STUFF YOU CAN BUY AT YR NEAREST MOTORCYCLE DEALER THAT CLEANS OUT RUST AND STUFF OUT OF YR GAS TANK.

LESTER

GRAND RAPIDS, MI

fuel filter

yeah but wouldnt a fuel filter (which i have) take care of that??

==chris

Re: fuel filter

well you would think that but still somtimes stuff gets through and buid up in the jets or maybe its yr fuel filter thats being clogged but these are just suggestions

LESTER

Re: fuel filter

yeah good point, maybe youre right. thanks lester!

==chris

Re: who wants $20?

XBrandon EdgeX /

Maybe the carb float is misadjusted, to where it only lets a little gas into the bowl, like it trickles into the fuel bowl when it's not running, then when you start it up, it uses up what was in there and it can't get enough fuel. To check the float, take the bowl off, and flip the carb upside down. if the surface of the float nearest to the carb body is parallel with the underside of the carb body, it's adjusted right. If the float is kind of pointing up, it's gotta be adjusted.

To adjust the float, pull the pin that the float pivots on and bend the brass plate accordingly.

float

yeah, i have tried messing with the position of the float, and i checked earlier this afternoon to see if it was in the right position. when i checked it, it was tipping up a little, so i bent it back to normal. but that still didnt fix it. i think you might be onto something though with the idea that fuel is being restricted and just trickling in somewhere, then getting used up and stalling it out....but where???!?

thanks!!

==chris

Re: float

XBrandon EdgeX /

maybe your petcock it clogged. or did you check that already?

Re: float

InfectedBootSector /

I would put in a new float... how old is it? It seems that after a while, they lose their bouancy (sp?) as they age. I had the same exact problem... replaced the float and float needle and it works great now...

Not sure if this helps or not...

Re: float

yeah i think i will try a replacement float. i thought it was the petcock and i replaced that but it didnt help. thanks!

==chris

Re: float

InfectedBootSector /

Let me know if that helps...

Re: who wants $20?

just so everyone knows, my moped is still not running good, and the 20 bucks is still up for grabs to anyone who wants to come fix it!!!

==chris

Re: who wants $20?

if you can't figure out what it is ... start from scratch and work every angle. it'll take a while ... but less than a piecemeal approach.

first, drain all the fluids. empty the gas tank and the crankcase. check them out. are they dirty? if trans fluid looks ok, fill the crankcase up again w/ type-F transmission fluid. then check your gastank. is it rusty? someone posted some ideas on how to clean a gas tank. a free spirit is nice because the tank is removable. makes it easier to clean.

then take apart the carburetor. if possible, get it soaked and soaked in carb cleaner. go over every single little bity part one by one. check it all. even if you've done it before. lots of carb cleaner and compressed air. reassemble it. check your manifold.

take of the head. is it dirty? do you need a new gasket? what do the pistons/rings look like? make sure there isn't gunk on the head of the piston. clean it if necessary. check it all. you may even want to dismount the engine and clean it on the inside if possible. reassemble it all.

get a new spark plug (bosch platinum). check all the wiring. check the timing. put the bike together ... see if you have spark. if you do, then start mixing some new gas. check your petcock for flow.

god willing, your bike should run. for details on all these proceedures, go to fred's guide ("how to fix your moped") in the resources/articles section of this site. good luck!

Re: who wants $20?

chuck russo /

your flot might have a small crack or cut in it and fuel is weighting it down and stalling the motor i had this happen to me on my dirtbike i replaced the float and it was fine

Re: who wants $20?

Ron Brown /

Chris,

As I understand your problem, your prd starts, runs a short distance then "bogs" and dies.

Try the following:

If it will start back up and do the same thing if you wait a minute or two, and,

if blipping the choke as it bogs improves the running momentarily, and,

if you turn off the gas before starting it up and the symptoms are about the same except maybe it quits a little sooner,

you have gas flow problems. Try this and report back, I need the money : )

Ron

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