Re: No retalitation to come

Great to hear your healing,man! Take it from me;the older you get you notice how much more slowly you heal.Just a sad fact of life,I guess.Yeah,Wayne,I think you've `hit it' there with the I.Q. thing.These people are smart,and they're tough,and they're not afraid of a little ridicule while travelin' in style.I'll bet you miss that `ped with all that gadgetry and good sound,don't you?If you were down here close I'd lend you a Tomos just to see what gadgets you could put on it for me.I took some great long trips earlier this week on my Motomarina with it's Minarelli engine and a stereo would have been great to play some travelin' music on.Did about 350 mi. or more and NO STEREO.WAAAAHH!!!

Re: No retalitation to come

glad to hear wayne is back.

and back on the philosophical-theological discussion. i also agree to disagree and hope i didn't seem to not respect anyone's opinion. but ... here again ...

i do think righteous wrath is ok. that's why i quoted albert camus, who writes extensively about the subject (in ways that i truly respect and agree with). but that doesn't mean hate. i think it's acceptable to kill ... in very limited circumstances. but i'd never rejoice in the killing. extinguishing a person's flame of life is never a joyous occasion. i can punish someone for their evil w/o hating them. hate the sin; love the sinner. i know it's hard. it sounds truly idealistic. but ... as a christian, it's my duty. i am told that i must pray for my enemies, pray for those who persecute me.

that's also why i respect camus so much. he was an atheist ... yet he still held on to the same basic code of ethical behavior. he even admitted how much harder it was for him, since he didn't share the religious person's faith in a god.

i'm willing to support the civilized people's of the world waging war (and i do mean war) on terrorism. but i don't want to see us reveling in the streets and dancing when we count the enemy dead. i don't want to see us turning our patriotism into a blind hatred for those who speak a different language or pray to a different god. i don't want to see the hands of our soldiers bathed in blood instead of justice. it's a very fine distinction. a very difficult balance. but it's one worth fighting for. it's the only thing worth fighting for.

Re: No retalitation to come

I respect your opinion,Miguel.I guess the difference is,I'll be joyful when whoever these mad dogs receive righteous retribution,because I'll know at least THEY won't be killing innocents anymore.It's so sad to see those poor people suffering.I hope no little children suffered too much.Little children are so wonderful.What are you doing up this time 'o night, anyways?

New Trade Center

Wayne Broderick /

This is a tiny ray of light in a dark time. This picture gave me a short laugh in the face of horror. I also think this shows the American Spirit.

newwtc.jpg

Re: New Trade Center

Well Wayne,I like the look of it but I'm VERY AGAINST designing ANY structure that people can't easily be rescued from.In my humble opinion there's just no reason to endanger people that way just for looks.NOW,I realize I'm talkin' to the `Gadget Man' and you LOVE extraordinary things,but so many narrow escapes have been reported from the higher floors,and no-one seems to have escaped hardly from above the 90th floor,that I'm really against going over 20 stories.I know I'm a `country hick'that has to travel 70 mi. to see a very tall bldg.,but I just can't agree to a building that has no outside(in fresh air) escape route.I guess skylines just don't mean anything to me.I'd rather see the 5000+ people still enjoying their lives.They talk about lack of space but look at the other cities that just sprawl out and build better roads to transport people.I'm a `gadget man' on a way smaller scale than you.I love special things and I'm always running inventions of one sort or another thru my mind.Don't you be sitting around drawing anyhow! Get well and get out there Wayne!

Re: New Trade Center

Wayne Broderick /

Did you notice it (the building) looks like a hand giving the middle finger? That's what I thought was amusing. You can blow us up, but you can't kill the spirit.

Re: New Trade Center

Wayne,I didn't even notice that.Gestures are definitely not my `forte'.

Re: No retalitation to come - That's what you thin

I haven't read this whole post to see if anyone else made this clear, but the US will make retribution against the current foe. I know this for a fact, I can't give out details, but I have friends in the military and retaliation from us is imminent at this point.

Wyn

Its not that simple

Exactly... who?... is "the current foe" ???

You can't answer that.

And that's why there is no simple easy response to this.

And only the top brass in the military know what might be done.

Your buddies are only told to "get ready"... they never tell them what for.

Re: Its not that simple (conspiracy)

Wayne Broderick /

I read something about the government knew Pearl Harbor was coming, and kind of let it happen anyway.

The conspiracy sites I go to are always talking about the 'illuminati' and the 'NWO', and they suggect this bombing could be used to restrict civil liberties (even ones that don't connect to the bombing)

I'm still looking into this, and can't get enough information to make a totally coherent statement that I can back up with facts.

Just be aware that we have declared this a "war" against the country that harbors or supports the terrorists. What if it is the USA--? We were watching two of those guys (for bombing the Cole), and they still managed to hijack the planes.

Does that make it a war against the American people? By Bush's logic, yes.

Nationwide Phone Taps, Total internet monitoring, random stops in the street and on the sidewalk, racial profiling, and searching without warrants. Add "Martial Law" and "FEMA" control, and we've put the Govt. into a position to do anything it wants, with NO citizen control. Add to that a government controlled "media blackout" and it gets really scary.

That's the problem with a "State of Emergency" is that it supercedes the constitution and the bill of rights, which, at face value, seems like a very unamerican thing to do.

This is very complex and we need to resist media attempts to 'simplify' the situation. Even the people who study mid-east for years and years don't understand it all. It's really that tough---

Re: Its not that simple (conspiracy)

ok ... state of emergencies don't suspend the constitution. or anything like it. it's just a way to let the president do a few extra things quickly.

and i don't think we knew ahead of time or anything like that. i've never taken x-files that seriously (as great a show as it might be in terms of entertainment).

i'm sure there were warnings ... but ... there are warnings and rummors of millions of things all the time. so when it happens, we can think that we had "warning" ... but it was lost in the millions of other warnings (the ones that never happened).

it does look like retaliation is happening. i hope it follows the basic principles of "just war" theory (at least) and doesn't turn into something horrible. but i also think the american people (and the world community at large) are more mature than we were before. so i think the constitution and our bill of rights will stand.

see you all in afghanistan! ;-)

Re: No retalitation to come

I have to agree somewhat with the big fat bully....the only reason any action at all has been taken so far is because the government is under the gun at the moment. Wait a few weeks and everything will die down.

And I, too, am sick of hearing about those middle east assholes always fighting. It's been that way as long as I can remember and I don't see them working it out too soon on their own. In the meantime, countless Americans are being killed by one means or another due to it. However, I suppose CNN is getting rich off of it. Anyways, I'm a 32 year old single white male that only makes 25k a year, so my opinion no longer counts....I'm the new "invisible man". Hmm, I wonder if i could sneak into my neighbor's house and watch her shower....

Lane

Re: No retalitation to come

Get out your camo paint, guys..... I think Bush is going to have to mobilize the army....the MOPED ARMY !!!

How do I mount a grenade launcher on my bike ???

Re: No retalitation to come

Wayne Broderick /

If the Moped Army sends a special unit to the gulf, the war will be won.

The Afghans would panic when they saw 50 modified mopeds screaming up the donkey trail.

Re: No retalitation to come

Ban the Taliban! I wouldn't want to be a hard-headed member of that `coward sheltering' organization right now!

Re: No retalitation to come

actually ... check the photo archives on the site ... we have pics of the 1st independent polish parachute brigade using folding mopeds (wellbikes) in combat operations in ww2. the wellbikes were also used by some elite british parachute units.

No retalitation to come (1st Shots!)

Wayne Broderick /

http://www.dailytelegraph.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,2919473%255E701,00.html

There is a link to some news, it's a breaking story. British special Ops have a shootout with the Afghans.

I had to rummage for the story, so it might not make it to CNN for a day or so.

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